Questions about an early Bonny Doon press

Jewelry Discussion
1

I was lucky to be able to buy a lightly-used, very early Bonny Doon press. It’s early enough that the return springs aren’t enclosed in the side pillars.

I’d love some information, if any of you BD enthusiasts can share.

There’s no manual with the press, but except for the springs, it looks a lot like the Classic. However, we think it’s much, much heavier. The frame is 33-1/2" tall, 16" wide, and 9" deep, with 12x8x2" solid steel platens that extend 1-1/2" front and back (past the edges of the frame). It’s made of welded 1/4-in wall 3x3 tubing. It came with a PT 1/4HP pump.

I haven’t been able to take a close look at the ram (to look for identifying info), but the seller said it’s 20T. My husband thinks the frame looks way larger than the current “Classic” and as if it’s designed for a much higher load. I’ve read many posts suggesting that’s how Lee Marshall built them - design for 50T and configure for 20T.

We’re probably not going to be able to tell how much it weighs - it’d break our scale - but we know that two strong guys weren’t able to “power lift” it off the floor. We’re guessing it weighs over 200 lbs.

If anyone knows where a manual for this might be downloadable, I’d appreciate suggestions (I’ve already struck out on Internet Archive, Bonny Doon, RioGrande, ManualsLib, facebook groups, and other obvious suspects).

Thanks

Caroline Rumsey

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The actual press looks very similar to mine. Mine is maybe 8 years old. The ram looks like it may have been retrofitted with a power pack and with the springs being part of the retrofit rather than a part of the original design. Let us know what you find…Rob

3

For comparison, my BD deep draw 20 ton press (not the Classic) is only 28 1/2 inches tall. The platen is 8" square and 1 inch thick, not 2 inches thick. It does not weigh 200 lbs. because I lifted it myself.

I don’t remember getting much of a manual with mine. It would be nice to know the safe capacity if it is above 20 tons, but if you are just using a 20 ton jack it wouldn’t matter.

Good luck with it.
Neil A

4

Thanks for your response.

The seller said she bought the press over 20 years ago, new, for a workshop she attended. Everything she sold me, she said she had bought new for that workshop.

5

Thanks for the info. How old is your press? The height of this one, and the thickness of the platens, makes me wonder about the design of the early 50T presses. (Or maybe it was a limited edition built for the workshop the seller attended.)

My husband is trying to figure out a clever way to weigh it (he was muttering about load cells). I’m thinking attach a spring-loaded old-fashined dry goods store scale to the tail of our hoist, and just do the math.

This is all primarily curiosity, since there’s no documentation; an irresistible mystery. I’ll probably forget about all that once it’s on its table and I can use it.

6

Caroline, my press is around 5 or 6 years old. (It could be a few years older.) That’s the best I can do - senior memory / lack thereof.

The height of this one, and the thickness of the platens, makes me wonder about the design of the early 50T presses.

If you look at the BD presses on the Rio Grande website you will see that the greater-than-20-ton presses have really massive sides. The side posts on yours do not seem robust enough for 50 tons in comparison.

The platen thickness on yours makes sense in that the 12" width might need to be stiffer to not deflect under maximum load, compared to my 8" wide platen.

BD has deep draw tooling to make vessels, now only using 3" or 6" 18 ga. discs, but originally BD had tooling to deep draw 12" wide discs into vessel shapes. That would work with your taller press and wider platen.

I don’t know if the 12" deep draw tooling can be powered by a 20 ton press. My foggy memory is trying to tell me that a 25 ton press might have been required.

For those who may read this and who have not used a 20 ton press before, Susan Kingsley’s book

probably covers safety (eye protection, etc.) as well as creative use of a press, worth reading, or perhaps there are free online videos. I once saw an irregular-shaped block of wood that was used as a spacer to jack up a motor home go flying and severely hurt a man’s leg, and it wasn’t under anything like 20 tons of pressure.

The Durston press comes with a safety shield, and would be my choice now if I were buying a new press.

Neil A

7

I think you hit on your answer and that this press is either a prototype, a limited edition or a custom press.

In case you don’t know, the original founder and owner of Bonny Doon was Lee Marshall. Lee was an engineer and inventor. Lee designed and built many prototypes of tools that never made it to market.

I used to run a jewelry program in California. Lee donated a couple of his prototypes to us once. An English wheel and something else.

After Lee retired, he sold Bonny Doon to Phil Poirier. Phil went into partnership with Rio Grande, which is why Rio Grande has an exclusive on Bonny Doon products. (Unrelated after Lee retired, he couldn’t stop working, designing and making. He started another company and founded Knew Concepts tools.)

Eventually, Phil sold Bonny Doon to someone else. (I don’t know them).

Back when Phil owned Bonny Doon he told me that they used regular hydraulic jacks and customized them with stronger gaskets and other internal parts.

Before Rio Grande had an exclusive deal with Bonny Doon, I bought my gold electric Bonny Doon press from Otto Frei in Oakland. It had to have been sometime in the 90’s. (at least 30 years ago) I’ve never done anything to it including not changing the hydraulic fluid (which you’re supposed to do.) My press still works good as new.

Since Rio and Bonny Doon aren’t helping you solve this riddle, I shared your post with a friend of mine who teaches hydraulic press workshops and was a good friend of Lee Marshall. I’ll let you know what she says when I hear back.

Other than wanting to know more about the history of your press do you have specific questions? I’ll be surprised if you can find an owner’s manual for this old press. Especially if it’s an old limited edition or a prototype.

Each current version Bonny Doon press has an owner’s manual available to download off of the Rio Grande website. You can probably find much, if not all, of the basic info about maintenance and use from current version owner’s manuals.

Here’s one for example.

Congratulations!! What a find!!

Jeff

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I reached out to Cynthia Eid to ask about your press. Cindy teaches a lot of hydraulic press workshops. I actually forgot that she worked for Bonny Doon back in the day. Anyway here’s what she said:

"I’ll bet that there is no manual for that press. Lee was not great at writing instructions. When I joined the team, I took that on, for the most part.

If I were that person, I would look for a manual for the electric pump. And perhaps, the ram. To me, the motor is the main part that needs to be maintained. Take a look at the oil. Is it full? Does it look clean? If either of those answers is no, add, and/or replace the oil. Lee used to tell us to just get hydraulic oil at the hardware store, and he didn’t change the oil unless the thing wasn’t working.

Phil Poirier, however, recommended SPX Power Team 9637 Hydraulic Standard Oil, and frequent oil changes.

And, look at the current manual for some basic safety instructions, such as: make sure to use spacer blocks with face plates, to protect the platens and to not overextend the ram."

Big thanks to Cynthia Eid!! Cindy is a master of many metalsmithing talents. If you’re curious about Cindy’s work and her workshops here’s her website. She also co-authored a fantastic book called “Creative Metal Forming.”

Hope all this helps! Again, congrats on your hydraulic press find!!

Jeff

1 Like
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Jeff, many thanks for all the insights. I’ve read Susan Kingsley’s book, and have a couple of Cynthia Eid’s as well - her work is amazing. I started with the current BD and PowerTrain manuals - PT at least had a manual for the model pump I have. Many thanks to Cynthia Eid for the great advice - I’ll review the manual and find out how to “check the oil.” We hope to have this thing usable by the end of the week, and I can’t wait.

Caroline

1 Like
10

Does anyone have a good source for a replacement 20 ton bottle jack for the Classic Bonny Doon Press? I am not the original owner so I don’t have the purchase invoice that Rio Grande requires for setting up a repair ticket. I contacted Bonny Doon directly and was told I might be able to buy a pump but it would cost over $430 plus shipping. I currently have the broken bottle jack at a local repair shop awaiting an estimate.

The jack, in a closed down state is approximately 11" high with a 2" diameter ram (post that goes up and fits in a flange screwed to the bottom of the lower platform). I have looked around but most of the jacks are either too low, require a screw to be extended, are extremely expensive ($700+), or look too cheesy to be safe. Any information would be welcome.

Donna

11

20 ton bottle jacks do not need to cost that much. I used a Harbor Freight jack like this one for years, gave it away with the HF shop press:

For the BD Model III press I use a pneumatic / hydraulic jack like this:

which I work by hand most of the time, but use with an air compressor if I’m in for a lot of repetition. It works about as well as the BD electric for thousands of dollars less - if you have a compressor.

The combo jack is 11" tall when at rest.

Either one works well.

Neil A

12

My BD jack has a pressure gauge on it. Usually I rely more on feel and what I see happening than the pressure on the gauge. This is with the exception of impression dies. I do like to watch the pressure as I work down to tiny pieces of urethane when using an impression die. I could probably get over this if I had to. Adding a pressure gauge to a common bottle jack is probably not a big deal, I just don’t know how to do it. Otherwise, a HF 20 ton jack will likely work as long as there is clearance…Rob

13

Donna,
I don’t think that you say what’s wrong with your bottle jack, just that it doesn’t work. Have you tried adding some hydraulic fluid? That’s often the problem with an old jack. Or there is an air bubble in the hydraulics. Unless something weird has happened that I can’t imagine, rather than buying a new jack you’re on the right track of repairing the jack that you have.

Before I wrote this I googled “repairing hydraulic bottle jack”. There are countless YouTube videos showing how to repair these jacks. There are way too many to list. Everything from how to add and change the oil, changing the seals, bleeding the jack to remove an air bubble, adding a pressure gauge, to a complete teardown and rebuild.

These bottle jacks are not that complicated. You said that your jack is currently in a repair shop now. I’ll be surprised if they can’t fix it for a reasonable cost.

Once your jack is fixed the best things that you can do is whenever the press is not in use is to release the pressure completely, to never over extend the ram (don’t ever fully extend it) and to never exert too much pressure. (the easy answer is with a 20 ton jack, don’t go over 6000 psi. Your jack can go higher than that, but I’ve never found a need to.)

I’m sorry that Rio Grande and the current owners of Bonny Doon aren’t being helpful, but I’m confident that you can either fix this jack yourself or find someone to fix it for you.

Keep us posted!

Jeff

14

Update (for anyone still following the original thread): There ARE springs in the side pillars pulling down on the platen. The “exposed” springs’ function is to bring the ram down. I managed to get a photo, looking down into a pillar:

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That’s how my 20 ton BD press is constructed. I am not sure why additional springs are needed other than to speed up the process, which in my case, is pretty fast. It’s pumping it up that is slow…Rob

16

Interesting. Let’s see if I’ve got this right? You have a 20 ton jack with an oversized 12"x12" press. I still think this might be a custom press or a prototype press. Like I wrote before, Lee Marshall was always experimenting and trying new things. Nothing wrong with two sets of springs. It’s probably very efficient.

17

Is that press labeled bonny doon anywhere? The welding is below par for all of the bonny doon presses I’ve had.
Judy H

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I always completely release the pressure on the pump. The problem first started with the gauge. It stopped holding and the pressure would slowly release by itself. I replaced the gauge and used teflon tape and watched the assembly intruction video. The pump still lost pressure and it wasn’t at the gauge connection. A friend told me to top of the fluid because her pump had the same problem, but worked once she topped it off. However, when I tried to remove the plug, half of the rubber plug crumbled away and fell inside the pump. I was being gentle and using only my fingers and nothing sharp or hard. Rubber just does not hold up well in Hawaii. I don’t know if it’s the heat and humidity or if there is sulfur in the air or what. Anyway, the bits of rubber will have to be removed and probably the seals replaced. The repair shop’s workload is backed up and they haven’t had time to give me an estimate. I’m just researching my options while I wait.

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I’m pretty sure the original photos didn’t include welds, just an end-view. I’m including a shot showng part of the top of the frame (taken to record the measurement) which does show welds. My husband looked at a video of the MKIII and said he thought this old press is welded better.

It’s definitely Bonny Doon. If I have the “code” figured out, it was made around 2001, possibly October 18.

20

Jeff, this does sound like a special design. I don’t know if the original owner had a private session with Lee Marshall, or if there were others attending the workshop she went to. Her name is scribed into the paint on the top left of the frame, so it appeaars to have been built for her.

The press came with all her tooling and supplies (which were used in the workshop); there are a couple of “containers” with urethane, some delrin dies for making bangles, plus acrylic and urethane squares (for silhouette dies). The top platen came with a square acrylic “protector” plate attached via the center bolt.