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DMSO follow up


#1

A while ago, there was discussion pro and against the user of DMSO
for inflammation.

[Edit]

Ref. thread
https://orchid.ganoksin.com/t/physical-therapy-and-maintenance

[/Edit]

I did research on it, and decided to give it a try. I ordered some on
line, in roll-on form, and have tried it on areas most affected by my
fibromyalgia, that being my right knee, elbow and shoulder, plus my
heel with plantar fasciitis.

The good news is, I experienced no taste in my mouth, no body odor
from it, though my skin itches/stings like crazy for about 10 minutes
after applying it.

The bad news is, it doesn’t seem to do much. It is no more effective
than arnica gel, my standby pain reliever. Applied on top of arnica,
it maybe increases the effectiveness a little bit.

I think I am better off sticking to arnica, and ice packs, which
seen to do me as much good without the itching.

There is no indication it has done me any harm, in any case.

Noel


#2

Hi Noel

…Manager and Senior Buyer for Health Plus Nutrition Centre by day.
…jeweller by night. … I’ve heard so many mixed reports on DMSO –
hasn’t been allowed at the retail level in Canada until recently –
and there seems to be a lot of side effects.

MSM (methylsulfonylmethane) is a related chemical, much safer and
used successfully for inflammation. Available in topical and internal
forms. Relatively inexpensive. There is a new product that mixes the
MSM with Eggshell membrane (a source of hyaluronic acid and
chondroitan – both antiinflammatories). New research shows success
with this combo.

Arnica is a good choice. . Traumeel (also a homeopathic cream) has
arnica. and a whole lot more. (Excellent product, but more
expensive.) Essential Oil of Lavender is an excellent topical choice
for muscle strain. . rub a few drops into the skin.

You could also consider any reputable supplement with Longvida
(registered) brand of curcumin (it’s been nanoized and is really
potent!)

Stretching is incredibly important for repetitive strain and
inflammation. Consider seeing an osteopath or massage therapist for a
list of useful stretches/exercises.

And of course, diet is important. Cellular pH can prove pro or con
inflammatory. …and pH is determined mainly by diet and lifestyle,
but also emotions and outlook. …Drink lots of water, plenty of
non-starchy veg. . fruit on an empty stomach. if you like coffee, try
it black AFTER a meal (alkalizing!)

As for emotions and out-look. . I hear your voice in your writing.
…you strike me as a very kind and warm person.

…so there’s lots of info you NEVER asked for!..sorry if I
stepped on toes. …the DELETE button is your friend.

cheers, and all the best (…and damn, you make fabulous stuff!)
~Audrey Morgan


#3
The bad news is, it doesn't seem to do much. It is no more
effective than arnica gel, my standby pain reliever.

All DMSO does by itself is help other substances cross cell
membranes easier. When we use it with horses, we usually mix it with
a dexamethasone powder, which is a steroidal anti-inflammatory, and
you have to get that from a vet. It’s really the dex that’s helping
with the inflammation; the DMSO just helps the dex get into the
affected area. But you don’t want to go around using strong steroid
powders with DMSO on yourself without a doctor prescribing it. And
you mentioned itching and stinging. A horse’s skin is way tougher
than ours, but even so after about five days of using a DMSO/dex
sweat, the horse’s skin will be what we call “scurfed.” There’ll be
big, flakey patches of skin that’s sloughing off, and it’ll be
really irritated and uncomfortable. It also increases the
circulation " what we partially want " but you’ve got to be careful
or you might irritate the skin enough for the horse to get a
cellulitis infection. I actually had a horse boarding with me a few
years back who had gotten permanent cellulitis on both his front
legs from having a DMSO sweat for too long. (Happened before he came
to us.) If that can happen to a horse, imagine what DMSO would do to
our wimpy human skin! OUCH! Stay with that arnica.

Eleanor Phillips


#4

Speaking of not warning the uneducated about using dangerous
chemicals, as one of our number corrected did, I would warn everyone
to be extremely careful using DMSO around all the chemicals jewelers
normally use.

As Elenore said, DMSO helps other substances cross cell membranes
easier.

Paf Dvorak


#5

re DMSO et al - can I put a word in for plain old castor oil packs
applied topically? I find them soothing on aching muscles - there
must be a reason the avid mountain hikers carry it for sprains and
strains!!! Barbara on a dark night on the island where the sound of
the coughing can be heard through the land. The turtle only sounds in
spring.


#6

Hi Noel, I use DMSO daily for bursitis in my elbow. This thing blew
up on me twice and I had to have it drained. Eck, motor oil from my
elbow! My DMSO comes from a local feed store. $5 I use it and and an
occasional Ace Bandage and have not see any swelling for a year. As
for plantar fasciitis, look to the New Balance on line store for
their shoe inserts. Have not had a problem since I started using them
two or three years years ago.

Bill
Reactive Metals Studio, Inc


#7
I use DMSO daily for bursitis in my elbow. My DMSO comes from a
local feed store.

I can get bute powder from my local feed store, but does that mean I
should take it myself? Only if I want to die from a bleeding stomach
ulcer after few days. Just because it’s OK to use on a horse and
they sell it in the feed store doesn’t mean it’s safe for humans.
And vice verse. I’m not giving my horse my Celebrex, and I’m not
taking his Previcox, even though both are Cox2 drugs. Each drug is
formulated specifically to work best for either human or horse
(Previcox can also work well for dogs in much smaller doses).
Sometimes I really covet my horse’s Adequan and wonder what would
happen if I stuck that needle in MY butt, but I don’t do it! Instead
I’ll stick to my human-doctor-prescribed Celebrex, which actually
works pretty well for plantar fasciitis and bone spurs on the heels
from 25+ years of running. Please people, DMSO " BECAUSE it can help
ANY SUBSTANCE cross over cell membranes, not just the good stuff "
is dangerous for human use. When I mentioned this discussion to my
father " a sometimes curmudgeonly but VERY experienced and
knowledgeable orthopedic surgeon " he said, “people are !#$%^!!
idiots. Go ahead and let them kill themselves with that crap if they
want to.” Then he shook his head in that way he does when people do
stupid stuff to destroy their health. Don’t use DMSO. It’s
dangerous.

Eleanor Phillips


#8

I’ve read some mixed reviews too, so I go by how it works for me,
which is pretty darn good, and I disagree about there being lots of
side effects. I tried to find some, and so did my doctor, and all we
found was the possibility of liver or kidney problems in people who
already had liveror kidney problems.

Another thing I heard was that it wasn’t veryeffective, and I found
my own body to be pretty responsive to it. Within a few weeks I had
markedly decreased stiffness, soreness, and inflammation in several
chronic problem areas. I thought "less effective than what, some of
the drugs that Big Pharm tries to force down our throats, but (most
of) which come with warnings of (effectively) "if it doesn’t kill
you, it may make you stronger ". Um, no thanks, and from what I read
inDr. Morton Walker’s book on DMSO, it actually does quite a few
beneficial things, in a very safe manner, compared to many other
more conventional optioins. A good free-radical neutralizer, and
probable reducerof scar tissue, among other things.

I also started taking it internally, and this was of course after
determining that this is a safe methodof intake. Don’t take my word
for it though, and naysayers say what youmay, but I’ve looked into
this and experimented to my complete satisfaction. Pharmaceutical
grade only, for ingestion, of course. I was havingindigestion
problems from bad snacking and coffee-drinking habits, so Iwas
worried that a substance which irritates my skin might make my tummy
worse, but I more or less fixed the tum before the dmso regimen, and
I have had no more problems. I’m not saying it helped; I’m saying
itdidn’t hurt, and I take it on a full stomach.

I have no real desire or need to convince anyone of anything, and I
don’t care what anyone thinks, I’m just reporting on my experience
with dmso, since the subject came up again. I have also started
using MSM (pure crystals) and homeopathic arnica, but these things
only after the significant improvement from topical application and
ingestion of dmso. Talking to an old cowboy today aboout it too, who
swears by it. "Oh yeah, I take the pharmaceutical internally too,
for my gout ". Anyway, I don’t think I intend to contimue these
experiments to see what kind of long term benefits I find, and I
plan to get blood tests for liver and kidney, just to be safe, but
at this point, I have no concerns, and I have determined to my
satisfaction that the negative publicity surrounding it is
unfounded, andthat a blanket statement like “it doesn’t do anything
but act as a vehicle for other substances” is an inaccurate,
incomplete assessment. Everyone I’ve talked to that’s used it
reports distinct, significant effects. That’s my two cents.

Dar (ps, yes, stretching, massage, exercise, nutrition, chiropractic. .)
sheltech.net


#9

I forgot that I did also read about side effects of headaches,
nausea, butnothing long term, and I experienced none of these
myself. The main thing for me is finding something, or a lot of
things, that work reasonably well, that are naturopathic, easy on
the system, and cost effective. DMSO is now an important part of my
regiumen for overall health and well-being, strenght and
conditioning, and recovery/maintenance of repetitive stress issues
That’s another area where I noticed a HUGE effect from topical dmso
use. After hard weightlifting sessions (medium weight, high rep), my
muscles felt normal again in about two days, as opposed to 3-5 days
before dmso, and when I strain something or stretch a little too
far, I’ve recovered in 5-7 days instead of a week or two. I’ve been
doing the same activities for 25 years, so I know howmy body
behaves, and the only difference in these situations I’m referring
to is dmso, so nobody can tell me it doesn’t do anything. Dar

sheltech.net


#10

…some of the dangers of DMSO have made it illegal to sell at the
retail level for internal use here in Canada. . we’re only, just
now, seeing it in topical form. . MSM is still a safer bet (topically
or internally)

Interestingly, there is a Canadian product: “Recovery” from Purica.
It was originally created for equine use, but can be taken by
humans, too. …it is a natural product with a much larger margin
of safety. and has been shown to be effective.

One question in this thread was about plantar fac. . having dealt
with this personally, I’d suggest a chiropractor who used the
ProAdjustor (a rare breed in Canada, but I found one!)…I’m not
a fan of old-school chiropractic. . doesn’t make sense to me to so
abruptly ‘adjust’ the spine. and if you don’t treat the surrounding
soft tissue, the ‘adustment’ won’t ‘hold’. AND STRETCH!! See a
chiropractor, massage therapist or osteopath, get the list of
stretches and DO THEM. … EVERY DAY. …NO MATTER
WHAT!!!..Seriously, it helps!

And again. …back to inflammation. . often the root cause. yada
yada. …

I also stretch out my hands and arms every day. whether I’m in the
studio or not.

…not a prescription. …all just suggestions from one Orchidian to
another. …

cheers, and have a grand day!
~Audrey


#11

Another mis-speak correction : the old cowboy dude I talked to was
not taking dmso for his gout, not for the gout itself, but for the
pain. Gout pain was one of the things it’s supposedly effective for,
according to Dr. Walker’s book.

Personally, I like the idea of dmso for a few basic reasons. First,
it works on me, and probably as important, it was determined very
early on that the theraputic dosages are well belowthe toxic dosage
levels, which basically, obviously, means that it’s safe in amounts
found to be effective.

Anyway, that’s enough about it from me. I use it, I drink it, I like
it. I smell like it . Your mileage may vary.

DS
sheltech.net


#12

Dar, would you mind expanding on why you also take dmso internally?
Is that still to help with strained muscles and the like? In my
reading, the only internal use I came across was for interstitial
cystitis, and I believe that was injected directly into the bladder
or something, not swallowed.

Noel


#13

Have to ditto the same effects for myself also and have suffered no
side effects. I also don’t have to convince anyone. If you want to
put your trust in big pharma go for it, but please do yourself a
favor and do some research. Things are not what mainstream media lays
on us all. Just finished reading’ ‘Seeds of Destruction’ which is
what ‘They’ have done to our whole agriculture system around the
world, and why they have done it will make your hair curl. By then
you’ll be mad enough to start doing your own research and not handing
over the responsibility of yourhealth to people whose motivation is
money and not necessarily keeping you healthy as they don’t go
together.

Peace
Carole


#14
If you want to put your trust in big pharma go for it, but please
do yourself a favor and do some research. 

Who should we believe? Real clinical researchers or tree-hugging
lo0ns who make a living selling snake oils and water with memories?
Anyway, here’s a link to some research I found.

DMSO sounds like some serious stuff and I for one ain’t messing
around with my health based on rumors on the interwebs.

http://www.ganoksin.com/gnkurl/ep7zw9

Here are some more reasons I won’t mess with it:

"Because DMSO easily penetrates the skin, substances dissolved
in DMSO may be quickly absorbed. Glove selection is important
when working with DMSO. Thick rubber gloves are recommended.
Nitrile gloves, which are very commonly used in chemical
laboratories, have been found to dissolve rapidly with exposure
to DMSO" 

"Dimethyl sulfoxide, or DMSO, is an industrial solvent that is a
by-product of making paper." 

Oral, mouse: LD50 = 7920 mg/kg;
Oral, rat: LD50 = 14500 mg/kg;
Skin, rat: LD50 = 40 gm/kg;

And since I work around cyanide…

Paf Dvorak


#15

Hi All,

Just chiming in with my 2 cents. In my “past life” I was a medical
technologist and at that time (a really long time ago) there was
some flack about DMSO possibly harming developing fetuses or causing
problems with fertility in women. Nothing has been proven yet in
humans, but in some lab animals this has been the case. With that in
mind, I would suggest seeking a doctor’s advice and using with
caution if you are pregnant or likely to be. Just a thought…

Tr


#16

I had a barrel racing horse with a torn shoulder ligament that I put
DMSO on. One day I dropped the toothbrush I was using to apply the
ointment into the bottle. The toothbrush melted. I’ve never used DMSO
again.


#17

Just a comment regarding research and DMSO. It is my understanding
that conducting valid blind tests using DMSO as a carrier or whatever
has not been possible with humans. Apparently DMSO can be detected by
the user - something about a taste like oysters - which means that
subjects know that it is in the formulation. I guess horses don’t
report such things, so research has concentrated on veterinary use.
Make of that what you will.

Judy in Kansas, where a lovely gentle rain is falling and melting
the rest of the snow. Just what the wheat crop needs right now!


#18

DMSO was pulled a few years back but local drug stores in Louisiana
still sell it for topical use only. it doesn’t do anything good on
its own for anyone due to the side effects that differ from person to
person but generally leave kidneys stressed and the liver- different
in every person depending on how compromised it is as a result of
other things you ingest…

As for arthritis, which was the initial impetus for people using it,
it did little to relieve pain.

Since it allows anything on your skin to pass through with the DMSO
here’s to hoping you apply it- if you insist on applying it- to well
cleaned skin. as microbes can permeate the dermis. period! Some
"naturopaths"use it in conjunction with essential oils- in that
context I can see reasonable uses as some essential oils DO have
real and powerful effects on the physical body, but DMSO would be a
last resort vehicle if some other way to get "x’ oil into the body
had to be ruled out- i. e. a tracheotomy, breathing tube, etc. I
myself have used it with - hold on folks- silver clay- to cure
parasitic problems in people’s pets, but the pets had no other
ailments, compromised systems, or anything wrong other than needing
an annual worming (note:some animals have no worms nonetheless, it’s
a preventative, a very small “dose” based on weight and does no harm
in small doses/applications to shaved skin in healthy animals over 20
lbs. anything smaller I wouldn’t attempt because the amount od DMSO
delivered is fairly imprecise).As it relates to a wormer, it is
similar to a family taking a course of chewable colostrum annually to
boost immune systems in a household. once a year for a specific
number of days and then done… DMSO won’t work with homoeopathic
remedies applied topically then a “top coat” of DMSO, to introduce it
into the system- nor will it work with Bach flower remedies, gem
elixers, etc. as the DMSO affects the subtle properties of all of the
above. provided you believe in the subtle properties of any of the
above having the ability to cure or correct dis-ease or malfunctions
of the physical or subtle body…

DMSO will leave a garlic-y scent on your breath as it so rapidly
courses through one’s system that it is “exhaled” through the lungs
in a garlic scented “breath”…

Why anyone still believes this stuff is a good, or worse, SAFE- is
beyond me. that’s why the USP pulled it years ago. anything left on
a shelf if you check the date is eithr overlooked inventory or the
store forgot about it in all probability, or still hopes to get their
money back!..don’t buy in !..rer.


#19

With all due respect to Elanor Phillips and her father/doctor, his
is but one professional opinion among many differing ones. From what
I can find, his is in the minority, and plenty of people use DMSO on
a regular basiswith no ill effects, and plenty of doctors say it’s
ok. Like I already said twice, the doctor whose book about DMSO that
I read, says that the theraputic dose is far below the toxic dose.
Of course, like I already said at least twice, anyone interested
should look it up themselves and get several opinions. There’s no
question it helps transfer substances in the body, but if one is
careful, I believe that it’s safe. The properties that some seem so
terrified of may also actually help the body heal itself. Hence the
title “DMSO: Nature’s Healer”.Be afraid if you want; be very afraid,
but at least learn more about it beforedeciding for sure. I don’t
necessarily trust conventinal doctors anyway, because most of them
have no problem over-prescribing toxic medications that they KNOW
have dangerous side effects, and some have real problems with people
using herbs, supplements, and naturopathic treatments that are KNOWN
to have beneficial effects, but have not gone through the
techno-bureaucratic process of FDA approval.

To each their own. Dar
sheltech.net


#20
There is no minimum lethal dose". That means that dmso is NOT
dangerous, by itself 

One thing my doc asked me to do was call the poison control center
to ask about dmso, so I just did. They said "for theraputic use
there are no toxic effects. Some skin and eye irritation is common,
and with internal use, some stomach upset is possible., so nobody is
going to be killing themself with it. because it’s impossible. Now,
there is this thing about it’sability to move SOME (not all !)
substances across cell membranes, so if left on the skin, anything
you don’t want absorbed into your system should not be touched for a
while. Here is where I have unanswered questions, and I welcome
factual scientific about the kinds of substances that
are and are not at issue here (for instance, it doesn’t react
withcotton much, if at all (iirc)), and also the period of time in
which it remains active on the skin in this way.

DS
www.sheltech.net