Anyone make their own solder?

Jewelry Discussion
41

I think that the pure form 24 K is best. better for the kidneys! And
mind…

42

Charles with pride pointed out that the Australian Mint had put
out .999 gold

The purest gold made was 999.999 (The purest gold ever produced.

Refined by the Perth Mint in 1958), even that was not 100% pure.

Kay tops it with Canadian Gold Maple Leaf - Wikipedia

The proud Canuk
Kay

43

Jo,

You need to re-read what I posted.

When a client orders a ring, it is a commission piece which is then
made up in whatever metal they ask for, to whatever size and design
we work together to finalise.

This happens for the most part after they have seen the SAMPLES; i.
e. the rings etc which are in the store, made up in random "average"
sizes with designs I alone have worked through.

A customer walking in off the street that loves every thing about a
ring, wants nothing different, no embellishment added, no
inscription and needs no size alteration? Yippee when/if that
happens.

I work from a studio, supplying four stockists with my work. I don’t
run or own a shop. Customers are sent to me, or their alterations
and size requirements are passed on to me, by the boutique/gallery
owners.

Kathy.

44 
9k is not gold. 14k is not gold. They are alloys of base metals
with some silver and gold mixed in.

Legally gold in the states is 10k and up, so although 9k is gold in
Australia it’s not gold in America.

However you are very wrong, as 14k is gold according to the US
standards.

If you don’t like it, change the law.

Regards Charles A.

P. S. Was going to have a rant about the use of the term
“unethical”, but I’m too angry to go down that path at the moment.

45 
In order for any alloy to exhibit at least some properties of gold,
and it is very important to emphasize SOME, not ALL - such alloy
must have at least 50% of it's atoms been gold.

Okay, I will bite. How is it determined that an alloy with less than
half of the atoms being gold will have none of the properties of
gold and an alloy with half or more has some of the properties of
gold?

46

Educated customers do not need university degrees to be educated
about jewellery!

Perhaps I should have said SOPHISTICATED.

One of the most educated and sophisticated women I have met, worked
in my local Jewish cake shop (yum)

and had the tattoo from a concentration camp, but did not think 9 kt
was gold.

I have 4 degrees from a B. A. to an M. A. (hons) nothing to do with
jewellery.

Chinese philosophy and Chinese medicine, to name 2.

There are those who understand quality gold alloys and those who do
not.

So mote it be.

Richard

47

Yep the stuff that is 25% crap 18kt that’s what I sell and so do
Hardy Bros Cartier Tiffany etc must be we are all crap artists LOL

I do however have a formula, untried, to make 99% gold that is
really tough/strong

Alloyed with 1% titanium. Trying to find someone to make me some as
I don’t have the set up.

If I do I’ll post. Can’t remember where I found this formula but is
could be fun.

Hey Al only kidding about the 25% water single malt is SINGLE no
additives for me.

With maybe a chaser of handcrafted, preservative free A grade beer.

Hey it gets hot where I live.

Richard

48

Hello

18kt white NO LONGER (for years has no Ni in Aust)

I will put as much effort into a ring in 9ct or silver as I will
in 18ct. Does this mean I am not a real jeweller?

Not at all it means you make quality (regardless of metal)

If I turned away all the 9ct work, I would be out of business and
filling my time making quality things for myself! Please don't
just dismiss the change in the times that we live in and the fact
that quality workmanship is also required in lesser metals.

I don’t get this as where I live the chainstores charge $150 a gram
for 9 kt.

I pay 18 kt fabricated, wire, sheet, ring blanks $55 a gram. And that
is expensive but they make great quality alloy. Not all alloys work
the same, so I pay more for what I like.

So for a 4 gram ring in 9kt which the chain stores would charge $600
for, I pay $220 for my metal in 18kt.

So for $380 dollars for labour I can hand make in 18 kt.

I can make and set a gem in an 18 kt ring in 1 and a half hours,
good profit for me. And the customer pays the chainstore price for 9
kt.

But business needs dictates what is made. So be it, average people
buy average jewellery and if that is your price point so be it.

Regardless of customers metal price point I agree quality is the aim
of the maker.

Richard

49 
forget water the analogy I use is single malt scotch. If only 37.5%
single malt and diluted with cola etc it is crap. If single malt
and liberated (technical term) 25% with pure spring water that can
be called quality. 
NO ICE.

Hello Richard, Particularly the more peaty flavoured, west coast of
Scotland single malts. The smother, central Scotland, Speyside malts
are as good with no water, IMHO. But we can absolutly agree, no ice
and definitely no cola. Like many things on Orchid, we all have
common ground but it is the differences between us that make all our
different work unique. Long may it continue and when things get
heated, kick back, enjoy a whiskey and feel mellow!Best wishes,
Charles

50

I have seen Celtic torcs that have lasted for more than10 centuries.
Fine gold.

Enough said

Richard

51

My reply to Marty: “please allow yourself at least some credit for a
lovely piece of coprolite. :)” was edited after I sent it such that
it wasn’t obvious that I was remarking on his belief that his days as
a chef did not result in immortal art. :slight_smile:

  • Lorraine
52 
I'll pay that, if you come to Australia I'll buy you a whiskey ;-)

You have a deal!

Best wishes,
Charles

53

I must have missed your post on gold dominance. In any case, 14k is
58.5% gold. Which is more than 50%, which makes, it seems, gold the
dominant material in the alloy.

But, then, I’m sure that I must have missed something…

Take care,
Andy

54 
However you are very wrong, as 14k is gold according to the US
standards.

I do not live by what politicians say. Science says only 18k and
higher is gold.

Leonid Surpin

55 
I have seen Celtic torcs that have lasted for more than10
centuries. Fine gold.

You can understand why, because pure elements don’t corrode at the
same rate as alloys.

If you dumped an 18 ct item in the same environment as the fine gold
torcs were found, usually bog, or burial finds, they’d be in pretty
bad shape.

Fine gold to me is an interesting element, and historically in the
Anglo Saxon times, it was pretty much all fine gold.

Regards Charles A.

56

Far out Richard, sounds like you’re under charging, you need to
value your labour a bit more than that.

I priced a ring at $800 (18ct), after talking to my teachers, found
that the price should have been doubled. I was under valuing my time.

I’m still trying to work out reasonable pricing for all parties in
my transactions. The main difficulty is that I under value myself.

Regards Charles A.

57 
But, then, I'm sure that I must have missed something..

Yes, you did. Please re-read my post.

I do not want to repeat it third time.

In short, the comparison is made on the basis of molar mass, not
weight. To achieve gold dominance as atom count, only 18k satisfies
the criterion.

Leonid Surpin

58 
Okay, I will bite. How is it determined that an alloy with less
than half of the atoms being gold will have none of the properties
of gold and an alloy with half or more has some of the properties
of gold?

Because Leonid said so.

James Binnion
James Binnion Metal Arts

59 
Okay, I will bite. How is it determined that an alloy with less
than half of the atoms being gold will have none of the properties
of gold and an alloy with half or more has some of the properties
of gold?

Simple answer. Chemistry!

Leonid Surpin

60

Hi

there seems to be a lack of reading comprehension and humour

If you can't afford it buy champagne or play in the traffic, real
goldsmiths don't care!!!!!!!!

Gold has always been a luxury item of the wealthy, look at gold’s
history. Did Faberge make eggs for the mass market, no.

Did Lalique make for the mass market no. Do I need to say more? Did
the gold Torc makers worry about the rank and file no.

Why should a goldsmith care if someone can’t afford quality gold?

Meaning of goldsmith is a smith working with gold. Not copper, not
bronze, not wood, but gold.

Well I am not alone, as a goldsmith.

But when I read something like what I have quoted above, it makes me
feel like to be a good jewelry maker, that I can only care about rich
people and treat those who aren’t rich as if they don’t deserve to
adorn themselves with jewelry. Is that true?

Of course not. But if you had read the previous posts they were
about quality gold alloys.

I sell jewellery from $10 upwards, but when working in gold use 18
kt, because it is quality.

Fine jewellery is a luxury item, however quality made jewellery does
not have to be fine jewellery.

One can make items in sterling, such as reticulated rings, that are
unique, beautiful and quality, I do and sell from $50 upwards.

There will always be those who justify low quality gold alloys, but
that is a specious argument (aka Bullsh*t)

To say it again quality jewellers do not use the low kt gold alloys.
They may use other materials to make jewellery

and as always work to the highest standards, but when it comes to
gold they use 18 kt or higher.

This post is becoming circuitous and redundant, one either
understands goldsmithing for what it is or one does not.

Never the twain shall meet, as they say.

When I work in gold I use only quality alloys, my personal
preference for metal is sterling silver. Because I like that metal.

This is personal choice. I find it more challenging than gold,
because of the firescale.

So I guess that last comment has got a few of you going. What the
arrogant, self-promoter of quality gold alloy prefers sterling?

Live and learn. But don’t even get met started on that sh*t that
needs a rhodium plating to make it look good.

Make quality in quality metal, do not cater to the lowest common
denominator.

Richard