I believe the trade will continue between the people who buy from
people.
That’s what I call art jewelry - jewelry made by a person who is an
artist in their craft.
Barbara on the island in the middle of a winter gale. Not going out
today, no sir, no way! Haven’t even seen or heard a plough.
Michael is indeed articulate and raises some excellent points, as
always. I 'be been reading posts addressing this theme from different
angles on Orchid for several years. They vary somewhat in point of
view but, to my eyes, most seem to be considering jewelry making as
a way to make a living. In doing so these posts – again to my
eyes-- for the most part take a less than positive stance on "art"
jewelry making, art metal academic programs and conceptuality in
general as it applies to jewelry making as a career.
My point if view is somewhere in the middle on this, but I find
myself asking :
Is the goal in jewelry and metal smithing only about making a
living?
Andy
Andy asks;
Is the goal in jewelry and metalsmithing only about making a living?
I can only answer from my own experience; For 95% of the fifty to a
hundred or more students and clients I work with annually, yes,
making jewelry is about being able to support oneself. For those not
currently doing so, they are working in that direction.
The other 5% are either retired or well invested and are not relying
on their ability at the bench or their studio practice as a primary
source of income generation. But, 100% of them are interested in
developing and refining their skill in the best way possible.
Perhaps 3% of them might refer to themselves as art jewelers, but
that is about all. I am sure my demographic doesnt represent everyone
else’s experience, but it does reflect the interests of the majority
of participants I interact with at the venues where I teach.
MDS
To those of you who think you CAN ride, if you can’t do a rising
trot for 10 minutes with out stirrups you have some work to do.
Well, I can actually do it for nearly an hour if I have to. I guess
that means I’m determined, and stubborn! But i think being
determined and stubborn is what it takes to learn to make jewelry. I
can trot without stirrups pretty easily now (after 35 years of
riding), but I used to cry doing it. It might now take me three
hours to set a stone with a completely clean bright-cut bezel top,
or to make sure my crown prongs pass the fuzzy sweater test, but
hopefully I’ll eventually be better at it than theposting trot with
no stirrups. Stubborn determination.
Andy
I think you have opened a can of worms with your statement
{ Is the goal in jewelry and metal smithing only about making a
living? }
If you ask most students I think they fully intend to make a living
with whatever they are studying. If they can’t then why spend the
money.
Yes, it is for gratification but isn’t it also gratifying when
someone buys your work and you make money and then can make another
piece.
I have stated this many times and will again, how many jewelry
designers graduate every year vs. how many are making a living at it.
Bill Wismar
Wismar Jewelry
Is the goal in jewelry and metal smithing only about making a living?
Well, in the context of the question that I asked, yes. I’m speaking
at a conference for college students and the entire conference is
about how they can, as self employed artists/artisans/makers support
themselves, preferably without a day job.
Without the feedback of sales, it’s rather difficult to keep going.
Why produce? Where are the deadlines? Who cares? Who loves this
stuff? There are fewer opportunities to show in galleries with Craft
than with art. There’s an expectation in jewelry making that you’re
a business and you’ll try to sell.
It’s a rather expensive hobby. I’d say better to take up something
cheaper, like knitting, but I know how much my friends spend on wool
yarn.
Is the goal in jewelry and metal smithing only about making a living?
I know a very well off couple, he and his wife have more money than
they could possibly ever need. The two of them took a ‘test’ that
was to help them understand how they felt about money. When asked,
what is the first thing you think of when you think of money? He
said, ‘We can always make more’, she said ’ We can lose it all
tomorrow’.
I think that sort of sums up how different we all are. In my case, I
guess the answer is yes. It is always about making a living first,
while getting as close as you can to doing what you dream of doing
with your life. That is if you want to work as a metalsmith full
time. But that’s just me. Everything in life is a trade-off and
there is never one answer that suits everyone.
Mark
I think that sort of sums up how different we all are. In my case, I guess the answer is yes. It is always about making a living first, while getting as close as you can to doing what you dream of doing with your life. That is if you want to work as a metalsmith full time. But that's just me. Everything in life is a trade-off and there is never one answer that suits everyone.
Well said. And important to remember.
That’s all true, Elaine.
But if sales are the only or ultimate goal, then makers will skew to
the market. I feel that there is room for both unsellable and
sellable and that helps to make a balanced career.
In my life as jeweler, metalsmith, maker–whatever-- I leave room
for both.
Selling is just not the ONLY goal.
Take care,
Andy
I have stated this many times and will again, how many jewelry designers graduate every year vs. how many are making a living at it.
That would be terrific to know, how could we find out?
CERF (I think it was) recently published a study of income among all
types of craftspeople. Unfortunately they included students, which
muddies the water a bit.
Elaine
Let the worms crawl, Bill.
My question was not meant to rile or bait. But I have noticed, at
least on this forum, that there seems to be a feeling among some, if
not many, that the ultimate goal is to make a living with metal and
jewelry work.
While I am sure this is the aim of a majority of students–it
certainly was mine, I feel that it’s important to state that there
is more to the pursuit of jewelry and metalsmithing than making a
living.
I say this as a maker --who supports himself–an instructor and as
someone who has not only stated many times the importance of
professional development and practices but volunteered a tremendous
amount of time implementing and presenting professional development
programs to students and at conferences.
I also say this as maker who has worked (and learned) at the bench
in trade shops and stores. I totally agree that the real world can
hit a newly minted graduate like a ton of fire bricks and that the
education offered in academic programs can and is often highly skewed
to the conceptual and can leave a student floundering.
Professional development classes and programs should certainly be
part of any curriculum. But I believe that the conceptual or
academically artistic is important as well and is not mutually
exclusive of a technically oriented life.
I also say this as a maker who has no BFA or MFA.
I hope that this discussion can continue without bringing the whole
art vs reality subject to the fore. But if it does I will be happy to
discuss it all. Because I really believe that there is value in it
all.
Sometimes I make work with sales in mind and sometimes I don’t.
The latter keeps the former fresh and the designs and ideas
engaging.
I know Michael and consider him a colleague and friend and have
complete respect for him as a maker, teacher and thinker. But I feel
that all sides need to be brought to the table.
Take care,
Andy
The other 5% are either retired or well invested and are not relying on their ability at the bench or their studio practice as a primary source of income generation. But, 100% of them are interested in developing and refining their skill in the best way possible.
This is my point, Michael. There are people who enter into jewelry
making because it’s something that they really want to do. And many
do not need to support themselves at it. But I see that as every bit
as valid.
To those of you who think you CAN ride, if you can't do a rising trot for 10 minutes with out stirrups you have some work to do.
OK, I’ll bite.
How do you post to a trot with no stirrups? Pull your legs up like a
jockey, and kneel?
(Keeping in mind that I was a western trail/pleasure rider. Never
got fancier than pole bending and quintains.) I can get from point A
to point B, and change leads when I need to. That’s about as
ambitious as I ever got.
Regards,
Brian
For 95% of the fifty to a hundred or more students and clients I work with annually, yes, making jewelry is about being able to support oneself. For those not currently doing so, they are working in that direction.
I gotta say that for Andy to even ask the question betrays a certain
naivete that only college professors seem to possess.
I also meet maybe 50 students a year - I visit schools and colleges
at times as a visiting old timer, we have shop tours of classes a
couple of times a year, we go to the shows and openings. I haven’t
done a poll or anything but I’d say MDS’s 95% might even be
conservative in thatcontext. Now, here in San Francisco we have the
Metal Arts Guild which is very casual, and many if not most of the
members are staunchly and unabashedly hobbyists and happy to stay
that way. Different strokes…
We’re friends with a rock star’s wife - stinking rich - her diamond
studsare matching D/Fl five caraters, and she doesn’t make jewelry
but she has some of our colleagues make it for her for her “hobby
business”. But it IS a business, even though she doesn’t need the
money to live. People like that are extraordinary, which simply
means not-ordinary, really. The rest of us need to work for a
living. Sure, I make art for art’s sake - I have a sculpture I want
to start for a public art project near our house. No pay there, just
because. The reality is that some of us, some of us here on Orchid,
too, are professionals in the jewelry business. Ourjob is making
jewelry though I guess a few are sales. And why not? Why and how
does it come to be that there’s something wrong or dirty or unseemly
about having full time work in jewelry, not struggling, not
failing?It’s bizarre…
Me, I come to work and make art all day - whether you want to say
that my art isn’t “real art” or somehow it’s not lofty enough just
isn’t something I care about. I don’t do shows, I rarely work on
spec but when I do it’s gone in a heartbeat, and in recent years
I’ve been putting in a whopping 25-30 hours a week at it and getting
paid very nicely, thank you very much.
You guys who aspire to something more thanwhat you have can do that
too, it just takes a LOT of work…
John D. and Jo-Ann too, in spirit…
Hi Andy.
{ Is the goal in jewelry and metal smithing only about making a living? }
Yes. What other goal can there be?
I say that only slightly facetiously. If your goal in life is not to
make the life you want, what are you doing?
I will cheerfully admit that my own career path isn’t even close to
what I envisioned, lo those many years ago, but I have managed to
make a life.
I will also admit that I sometimes wonder what on earth I was
thinking, picking up two art degrees, but I know myself well enough
to realize that while I could have done many more lucrative
things, I would have been a miserable person had I done so. So this
may not be what I had planned, but it is the life I needed to lead.
The ultimate goal in most human endeavor is to make a living. How is
that surprising or unworthy? At the end of the day, we all need to
eat.
That, and paying for my toys, of course. Because it’s really all
about the toys.
Regards,
Brian
Is the goal in jewelry and metal smithing only about making a living?
Gee, I hope not entirely, Andy! But I guess the extent to which that
might be true depends on the needs and desires of the individual
metalsmith, their time in life and the cards they were dealt in the
big game. A retired executive looking to open a small boutique with
her husband will approach the art of metalsmithing vs. producing an
income with an entirely different perspective than a 35 year old
father of two with a third on the way and two cars that need tires.
My words to Elaine’s students ~
If immediate income is a primary objective of a college student
contemplating a degree aimed at a new career in jewelry, bench
related or otherwise, I would recommend considering a different
profession. Other than starting out in commissioned sales (and that’s
no guaranteed picnic either), it usually takes a long time to get the
experience that builds the skills required to produce a decent
income, let alone start a business.
Unless one is born into it (like I was) or falls into a choice
position by luck, fate or some other outside intervention, one must
love it enough (and be in a position) to accept that they might have
to work for very close to free for at least a few years. Even (maybe
especially) with an express lane into the field, if they aren’t doing
it because of their love of forging metal and stone into art of one
kind or another, they’ll probably end up resenting or even hating it.
There’s just not enough money in it, for quite some time anyway, to
warrant doing it for a living if one doesn’t derive personal
enjoyment and satisfaction from at least some part of it. Most people
would make a lot more money right out of school as a mechanic,
plumber or electrician than they will as a metalsmith, degreed or
not.
Right now, if the student’s objective is to make money right after
graduating with a four year degree, a degree in one of the several
fields of Engineering would be good to have. Law would also be a good
one. I have no facts, but I’d bet that a university degree in Metal
Arts would be somewhat far down the list of income-producing degrees
for someone entering the workforce upon graduation. I can say with a
high degree of certainty that such a degree doesn’t add a whole lot
to the hourly wages of a starting goldsmith over someone that just
graduated from The Revere Academy of Jewelry Arts or the Texas
Institute of Jewelry Technology. Many potential employers will hold
the lesser diplomas in higher regard and will consider a university
degree in Art as a comparative negative for an entry level bench
position. A banking institution will require much more than a four
year degree and high aspirations as well before making a small
business loan. Please understand that I’m not making judgments or
casting aspersions, only stating reality as it currently exists in
the jewelry industry.
Someone counting on starting and feeding a family and/or a business
with a career in jewelry right out of school, regardless of the type
of school and their level of motivation is almost certainly going to
struggle, unless they have a rich uncle with a soft heart. That
struggle will be heavily compounded if the budding metalsmith has an
outstanding student loan of tens of thousands of dollars. I don’t
know for sure, but I think this would apply to pretty much any
artistic pursuit. I know several painters that spent a lot of their
early years painting more houses than canvases. Faux painting
bathrooms and refinishing hardwood floors seems to be far more
lucrative than selling from galleries for many, at least starting
out.
Heard this recently from a friend that repairs guitars for a partial
living. Do you know how to find an up-and-coming musician with a new
master’s in music in Nashville? Hold up your forefinger and say
“Waiter…”
If you don’t love it enough to embrace doing whatever it takes for
as long as it takes no matter how little it pays, study something
else that pays better. If you love your art and you believe in
yourself, you’ll do what ya gotta do and you’ll get by. If you play
your cards right, you might even do really well in the long game.
Dave Phelps
Hi
you get used to riding in long stirrups in a dressage saddle. It has
padding for the knees.
Then you need good jodhpurs and panty hose yes that is the secret.
The pantyhose slide against the jodhpurs instead of your knee skin,
OUCH.
The horse’s gait throws you out of the saddle and as you descend you
use your knees to slow the descent.
To be physically able to do this you must be able to squat down on
one leg with the other leg out in front of you Off the ground.
Most people “stand in their stirrups” to do a rising trot. The use
the stirrups to put themselves too high out of the saddle. WIthout
stirrups it is especially important to have good lower leg contact to
give the aids.
If you are on a good dressage horse the slightest variance in aid
can change things completely.
When I studied at the riding school we had to line up in teams for
parents presentation.
Well I was on Ma’s (not my mother but owner of the school, who by
the way learnt to ride on a pig, A grade dressage Arab and needed to
move back a little. So I began reigning back when Ma yelled “Sit
down!” which I of corse did, don’t argue with Ma. Sitting down means
pushing your weight down into the saddle. This did nothing for my
gentle back ward movement. The horse had been told by me to do leap
forward into some fast moving somewhat bemused parents. A levade is
the technical term.
As I am thinking “Well this is sh*t!” I here Ma applauding and
shouting well done.
Tricky old lady she was. Was I proud of being able to do a levade,
sure was.
Ma was brilliant with horses. Pity about the parents.
She liked to give them a little speech.
“The children you brought here, are not the ones you are taking
home, they have changed.” Yep a week of shoveling horse shit at 6 in
the morning takes your breath away.
Richard
Hi again Andy,
My reply last night was an off-the-cuff quip, with tongue more than
a little in cheek, but the more I think on it, and read your
followup, the more I think that may be my real answer. (In faceto
veritas?)
If you’re not trying to make the life you want, what on earth are
you doinge
I’ve heard Metcalf do his famous “wait tables” speech. (Advice: wait
tables rather than do a grunt bench monkey job. Save what energy
you’ve got for important art.) I can see his point: after spending
8-10 hours a day being somebody else’s bench monkey, the last thing
on earth I wanted to do was come home and do more. On the other
hand, the skills I learned by being a bench monkey have stood me in
good stead in all the years since. At this remove in time, I’ll call
it a fair trade against all the ‘art’ pieces I didn’t make at the
time.
If you’re asking what I’d tell undergrads now, I definitely
emphasize the need for business, accounting and marketing classes.
My theory is that art can grow, but art doesn’t do you any good if
you can’t pay the bills long enough to let the art grow. So step
one is to focus on keeping the lights on, then worry about beating
Faberge at his own game.
I think metalsmithing occupies a very odd space in terms of
art/craft/culture. It’s so bloody technical, and the gear is so
blinking expensive, nevermind the cost of the precious metals and
that we have to spend a lot more time thinking about
the 'how do I pay for thise" aspect of it than any of the other
arts/crafts. Metalsmithing isn’t like the others. Our sawdust is
literally worth its weight in gold. That may be a good chunk of the
reason why it seems like metalsmiths are obsessed with sales. We
have to be.
Andy, I know your tool budget for last year was substantial, what
with that welder. Lee and I just spent more than $100K on a new
lathe. You don’t get to that stage if you’re not serious about the
business side of things. And that’s the part that most of us really
hate. So I emphasize how important it is. The best conceptual idea
in the world doesn’t do you any good if you can’t afford to fill
your torch’s tank, or buy silver.
FWIW,
Brian
Hi
I feel that it's important to state that there is more to the pursuit of jewelry and metalsmithing than making a living.
I agree, some jewellery I make to a price point. Some I make for my
own satisfaction.
The problem with those pieces is I am always being told buy the wife
and daughter “That is an heirloom piece.” aka give it to me. But I am
a sneaky old bastard I know their ring sizes and never make them.
Except they are now playing filling every finger with a ring!
I like to go through my gems and pick the one I want to start with.
I like to have a coffee and just look. I think what will I do with you
my beauty? What can do you justice? My darling little solitaire what
would you look good in?
Then I start making slowly and carefully, from my head usually
without drawings.
In the end I have piece I am happy with. And if it does not sell I
know two ladies who will “heirloom” it.
Richard
Hi Andy,
Selling was not the impetus behind my beginning to learn to make
jewels. It was the love of the jewels and the love of the learning
and the love of the processes and techniques. Those are what were
important to me, even as a single parent in 1976, working at a
full-time job at the time. It never felt hobby-like, it felt
essential. like I had found what I was supposed to be doing as the
artist I had felt I was. I had found my way to my ‘home’.
Unemployment hit, and as the unemployment rate increased back then,
and Evan had come into my life, we began to realize that we had to
make our own way vis a vis employment, and began to show my work at
at craft shows. This developed into full time employment, which
eventually, with a strong wholesale production line, helped pay for
college for my two children, pay the mortgage and feed us.
Making my work speak with my voice was always essential throughout
the years, even the production lines I designed. When it became
unnecessary, I ceased doing wholesale, but continued meeting my
collectors at retail shows. That way, I could keep making my stuff,
AND didn’t have to find a warehouse to store it, as opposed to
seeing it go to appreciative homes (just joking).
All of the above is by way of describing one path this one jeweler
took. and also, no undergrad or graduate degrees in art,
metalsmithing, jewelry making, etc. Just worked at the bench, took
workshops (Hi, Tim, Betty, Harold, Keith, Robert), asked other
jewelers (Hi, Donald and Judy Cook) and worked some more! Isn’t that
how it’s done? Well. once way it’s done.
I hope to be able to continue making my work for a long time to
come, enjoying the thrill of combining the stones, metals, and other
assorted accessories into wearable jewels.
Linda Kaye-Moses