PMC in general

You can shape PMC in ways that would be incredibly difficult or
even impossible using traditional metalsmithing skills. It allows
artists to work with textures in ways completely different from
sheet and wire, for example. The ease with which you can   
incorporate organic forms, too, offers many artists new
inspiration.
  "To my knowledge there is nothing that can be done in PMC that

cannot easily be done with either metalsmithing or casting
techniques."

I agree with Jim’s comments about PMC. In fact, when one considers
the price difference between making something with expensive PMC vs
very inexpensive wax and casting, PMC can’t hold a candle.

I belive many people like PMC because, (1) it is a relatively clean
medium, (2) it is simple to fire and (3) it is what some artists
start out on and are comfortable with. I have had a number of
students take my casting classes after PMC and say they will never
go back to PMC.

New inspiration is relative to one’s practiced skills. I knew one
lady who insists on making her prototypes in PMC then making moulds,
then waxes and finally does her production in cast metal. Why?
Because she never learned how to work with the wax to begin with. I
am not much of a wax carver myself though I do alright. But I have
some students who do brilliant work in it. They suffer no limit of
new inspiration.

Cheers from Don at The Charles Belle Studio in SOFL where simple
elegance IS fine jewelry! @coralnut2

Actually it is possible to get a very finished look with PMC. And
stones can be beautifully set. If you’re curious check out my website
at www.jmlcreations.com. It’ll give you a good idea of ‘what else is
possible’ with PMC.

Cheers!

Jeanette Landenwitch
Exective Director
PMC Guild

   However, I know people with very good metalsmithing skills that
love PMC because it *does things sheet and wire don't.* You can
shape PMC in ways that would be incredibly difficult or even
impossible using traditional metalsmithing skills. It allows
artists to work with textures in ways completely different from
sheet and wire, for example. The ease with which you can
incorporate organic forms, too, offers many artists new
inspiration. 

I’m not so sure that “we love it”, it’s ok, it’s very expensive, but
it does give us options to do more "cast look’’ stuff than sheet or
wire. I don’t like the fact that it’s still not very stable, even
when fired for maximum times. It still breaks when you try to bend it
even when fired for max time at max temps!

  To my knowledge there is nothing that can be done in PMC that
cannot easily be done with either metalsmithing or casting
techniques. 

Perhaps, but these things can be done faster in PMC than through
traditional methods.

I find all of this exhausting. On the metal clay list, there’s
constant yacking about which is better, PMC or Art Clay Silver,
which I find dull. On Orchid, whenever the subject of PMC comes up,
people decry and say how horrid it is.

It’s just a tool.

No one ever decrys wax and says wax should never be used!

I don’t understand why metal clay generates such strong feelings.

If you don’t like it, if you don’t need it, don’t use it.

Many people like it and many people don’t want to learn
metalsmithing.

For many of my students, learning to work with metal clay has
enriched their lives. PMC in particular, and metal clay in general,
are here to stay. They have a place.

Just try not to hate it so much, eh?

Elaine
Elaine Luther
Metalsmith, Certified PMC Instructor
http://www.CreativeTextureTools.com
Hard to Find Tools for Metal Clay

    To my knowledge there is nothing that can be done in PMC that
cannot easily be done with either metalsmithing or casting
techniques. 

Okay, in anticipation of the question in response to my other post
on this topic, where I said you can do things faster in PMC than
with traditional methods, here is an example.

One of the things PMC does really well is take a texture. Let’s
examine our choices for putting a texture in metal:

  1. hydraulic press
  2. etching, first preparing a resist somehow
  3. rolling mill with a texture plate purchased from Mettaliferous
    (or other method with rolling mill)
  4. engraving
  5. chasing

Maybe there are more, that’s what I came up with off the top of my
head. Chasing would require the fewest tools. The rest require
specialized, sometimes expensive tools.

Say I want to put a texture in PMC. Here’s what I can use:

  • a rubber stamp
  • a texture plate made from polymer clay
  • a texture plate carved into special rubber carving stuff sold at
    the art supply stores
  • plastic texture plate
  • Silicone Texture Plate ™
  • a piece of lace
  • a green leaf
  • a cool looking plastic coaster from the 1970s
  • a bar of soap with a design carved into it

you get the idea.

I roll out the PMC to the desired thickness, roll the PMC on the
texture, or the texture on it, and ta da, I’m done, no specialized
or expensive equipment.

And PMC is not inherently “raw around the edges.”

It can be finished to metalsmithing standards. It is not weak and
porous, when fired correctly.

I have pieces made from PMC that you would not “know it.” I wore a
piece to a Chicago Metal Arts Guild event and two metalsmiths were
admiring my pendant. I told them it was PMC. “Oh.” One of them
said. “But it looks…good.”

I suggest that sometimes people only recognize PMC when it looks
“clay like” and fail to recognize it when it’s done the way I strive
to do it, to metalsmithing standards.

Humbly submitted,

Elaine
Elaine Luther
Metalsmith, Certified PMC Instructor
http://www.CreativeTextureTools.com
Hard to Find Tools for Metal Clay

 PMC + only shrinks 12%.
    Even when fired at the highest temperature for 2 hours? 

Yes, the shrinkage is a little bit more when fired at 1650 for two
hours, I’m sorry I don’t know the percentage. Please visit

http://www.PMCGuild.com, follow the link the PMC Conference, then
technical resources, 2002 Conference, Handouts, third one down
“Comparative Chart of Firing Temperatures” gives you the most
complete available on the subject.

If you still have questions after that, anyone may email Tim
McCreight through the PMC Guild website with technical questions.

Elaine
Elaine Luther
Metalsmith, Certified PMC Instructor
http://www.CreativeTextureTools.com
Hard to Find Tools for Metal Clay

   To my knowledge there is nothing that can be done in PMC that
 cannot easily be done with either metalsmithing or casting
 techniques.
    Perhaps, but these things can be done *faster* in PMC than
through traditional methods. 

This is possibly the only advantage PMC has over other methods of
creating a form in metal or wax

    I find all of this exhausting.  On the metal clay list,
there's constant yacking about which is better, PMC or Art Clay
Silver, which I find dull.  On Orchid, whenever the subject of PMC
comes up, people decry and say how horrid it is. It's just a tool. 

Yes but it seems like a very poor one. It is brittle, it shrinks a
lot, and is ridiculously expensive for what is basically a mixture
of silver powder and dipity-do hair styling gel

    No one ever decrys wax and says wax should never be used! 

Sure they do , we get into that argument at least once a year on
Orchid :slight_smile:

    I don't understand why metal clay generates such strong
feelings. 

For me, because the majority of it is so artsy craftsy. It has none
of the characteristics that for me make metalwork so challenging and
satisfying. It reminds me of polymer clay in that it is mostly used
to imitate rather than innovate. I guess my feeling is if you want
to work in clay then why not explore ceramics.

Jim Binnion

James Binnion Metal Arts
Phone (360) 756-6550
Toll Free (877) 408 7287
Fax (360) 756-2160

@James_Binnion
Member of the Better Business Bureau

I agree with Elaine Luther. Let’s stop berating the use of PMC. I
tried it and decided that it didn’t offer me anything I happen to
prefer fabrication and in addition have a complete casting set up.

But, I respect other people’s desire to use it. I have seen some
very nice work being produced and for many it fills a specific need.
So, let s quite harping on this subject and be a bit more generous in
our acceptance of what others have chosen to do. As Elaine says, “It
is just a tool.”

Alma

Hi:

I finally got around to working with the PMC I purchased from a class
taken last June. I had since enrolled in a lost wax casting class
and was buying into the PMC snob thing. Though both wax and PMC have
their frustrations, PMC is easier to work with. The big difference
for me is that the cost of lost wax casting is lower.

Still, my favorite is working with wire. Instant gratification.

Rhona
Over The Moon Jewelry

I think Don, the coralnut, is right–part of the appeal of PMC is
its “cleanness” and simplicity of firing.

The experienced studio jewelers I’ve known who love PMC are mostly
fabricators who disliked contemporary casting processes when they
first encountered them, often because they didn’t feel “clean.” They
have no desire to spend money on equipment they really don’t want in
their studios. I’ve also heard them say that casting means spending
too much time on what they see as an industrial process that doesn’t
interest them. (Well, I’m extrapolating in part. They’re not usually
that articulate–it’s more like, “Casting? Yuck!”). And they don’t
like sending their work out to somebody else.

But I hear something else as well–they like the “immediacy” of the
PMC process, which they don’t feel with wax. Wax is a mediator
between the original creative impulse and the creation. Obviously,
for a lot of people on Orchid, this is not a problem. But if it’s
ever felt like a problem for you, you might want to try PMC. It isn’t
the devil’s spawn! Really!

Lisa Orlando
Aphrodite’s Ornaments
Elk, CA

PS: I wonder how many Orchidians, who would recommend Tim
McCreight’s other books in a heartbeat, have thought about why he
loves PMC. Do you think he’s sold his soul to Mitsubishi?

       To my knowledge there is nothing that can be done in PMC
that cannot easily be done with either metalsmithing or casting
techniques. 

A while ago there was a thread about how to label yourself as metal
artist, silversmith, goldsmith, ect.

If you work in pmc, how do we refer to what is done as opposed to
those who use metal working techniques to achieve their goal.
Fabrication and casting are metal working techniques in my opinion,
working with pmc is more similar to ceramics. PMC is not
metalsmithing.

Those of us who have spent years (20-30) learning how to work with
metal might be prejudice because pmc does not require the time and
discipline required to achieve results that fabrication or casting
requires.

PMC has resulted in a sort of dumbing down of a medium that at one
time required perseverance and skill to overcome obstacles.

Think about how much jewelry is made, and what percentage is made of
pmc, and it becomes apparent what part pmc plays.

I believe it is a second class citizen. The pieces I have seen that I
liked, was for the design, and it could have been done by casting,
and therefore was not special because of the fact that is was pmc.

Someone could argue that the speed at which you could make a piece
with pmc is an advantage, but the limitation overwhelm that
advantage. There are so many things you cannot do with pmc, the
advantages are a moot point to me.

Having made gold and platinum mountings, I doubt if I will be PMCing
anytime soon.

I am not putting PMC down, it is just my perspective. at this point
in time.

Richard Hart

Nice PMC work: it’s out there…

For all the goopy, squooshy PMC work you see, there are some people
doing work that looks good by “regular” fabrication standards.

In this month’s Lapidary Journal there is a Rio ad that features Ivy
Solomon (I don’t know if she’s on the Orchid list or not), who won
the Saul Bell award this year for PMC. Her business is called Ivy
Woodrose; she’s from Michigan. I’ve seen her work in person, and
didn’t know it was PMC until I saw this ad. She is enameling on the
PMC: her “frames” for the enamelled parts look fabricated, but I
don’t know if they are.

I don't like the fact that it's still not very stable, even when
fired for maximum times. It still breaks when you try to bend it
even when fired for max time at max temps!

It sounds silly but a clarification would help…

Does the above statement means that even after the piece has been
fired, the PMC will have the properties of clay??? I had thought
that after it had been fired what remained was 99.9% silver. And if
it is 99.9% silver, then instead of being brittle, it should be more
malleable.

I’d appreciate replies to clear my doubts.

Thanx all the same.
Hema

I have to agree with everything that James has said. I’ll add two
more reasons of my own…

The pieces made of PMC that I’ve seen to date have been far too
heavy. Casting can be heavy too if done incorrectly, but an
experienced wax modeler can make finished products as light as a
fabrication.

Most important - to me at least - is that it can’t be engraved!

Brian

    PS: I wonder how many Orchidians, who would recommend Tim
McCreight's other books in a heartbeat, have thought about why he
loves PMC. Do you think he's sold his soul to Mitsubishi? 

Nope. I don’t. Of course, I’m not in a position to personally
vouch for Tim’s soul. But, as previously established, Mitsubishi is
not the devil, and presumably, that’s who one sells one’s soul to,
eh? : )

I would never presume to speak for Tim, but perhaps he was intrigued
by this new material. Many people are excited by something new.
And we are in a field where changes are slow to come.

We all do what we have to do to support our families.

Elaine
Elaine Luther
Metalsmith, Certified PMC Instructor
http://www.CreativeTextureTools.com
Hard to Find Tools for Metal Clay

        I don't understand why metal clay generates such strong
feelings. 

I think it’s because there are people who view and use this material
as a shortcut to techniques that require a more highly developed
technical ability. It is a material that offers its own set of
working characteristics that have not yet – in my opinion–been
fully realized or exploited. It is just too sexy a material for
those who wish to become overnite jewelers and silver smiths. Until
PMC comes into its own, as Fimo more or less has, respected more as a
material that can produce effects uniquely its own than as a
“technical education in a can” (just add experience), it will
continue to generate these strong feelings.

I guess my feeling is if you want to work in clay then why not
explore ceramics. 

I think that this is in fact the edge that PMC can offer.
Exploring, discovering and exploiting the idiosyncrasies of the
material, ie its “clayiness” might open the door to innovation.

Andy Cooperman

 I guess my feeling is if you want to work in clay then why not
explore ceramics. 

Oh, because when you work with ceramics… you can’t set stones in
it, it shrinks, it is brittle, you can’t solder it-- it is a very
poor material for making jewelry!

I can understand not wanting to work in metal clay. I can understand
not liking much (most?) of what is done in it. I even agree that
most of the metal clay work out there is clumsy and amateurish.
(Though I think it could be said that there’s an awful lot of bad
crap in virtually every medium. Nobody condemns oil paint despite
the unbelievably bad work that is created using it!)

I can’t understand maintaining a determined prejudice against the
material itself. Like any other material or technique, it is value
neutral. Everything depends on the skill of the user. While some
materials/techniques (such as mokume gane) demand a high “threshold”
of skill before you can even start, anyone can buy partly or
entirely developed material from Reactive Metals and maybe
elsewhere. The basic difficulty is no guarantee of a quality result.
Is an ugly piece made of platinum encrusted with exotic stones and
mysterious techniques any less offensive than a clumsy blob of PMC?
I wouldn’t say so. If anything, it is a greater waste, with less
excuse!

In my, uh, humble opinion…

–Noel

I can't understand maintaining a determined prejudice against the
material itself. Like any other material or technique, it is value
neutral. 

It’s recycled silver, particles from old film, and organic material
and it shouldn’t cost SOOOOO much more than fine or sterling silver
sheet or wire. Let’s compare ozt to ozt . . . there is no
comparison. PMC or Silver Clay is just so much more expensive, yet,
you can only do "so much " with it, and it shrinks. It should be
less expensive than sterling or fine silver fabricated product
(sheet, wire, grain) whatever. Almost half is a “dippity doo”
organic binder.

Most of the pieces I’ve seen, have been very crafty, rather than
artsy . . .even the pieces that I’ve done, have not impressed me (
and please, I won’t claim to be an expert in anything.!)

The price of the product really bothers me.

RT

 The pieces made of PMC that I've seen to date have been far too
heavy.  Casting can be heavy too if done incorrectly, but an
experienced wax  modeler can make finished products as light as a
fabrication. 

The PMC pieces may look heavy because they are THICK (you need THICK
to keep it from breaking with use) but they are rarely as heavy as
cast items. The items are usually less dense than cast items,
especially when using PMC (origional) which shrinks more than 30
precent (although few want to admit that.) Hollow form, though, can
be very ,very light in weight.

Andy,

I have been hanging back in this discussion. I see people I know and
deeply respect taking a negative position and wonder why.

Of course everyone is entitled to an opinion, I just wonder why this
is striking such a deep nerve. We all have time in the trenches,
some more than others, so what. I at times, see less cluttered paths
to a solution. Friends need to take a more structured path. We are
both suiting out needs, one does not make the other lesser, nor
better.

I would hope we had evolved enough to look forward, not insist only
time tested paths are true. Were that so, we would all be waving
Orchid signals with blankets and puffs of smoke.

I cut, pierce, saw, fabricate, and yes see ways to incorporate Metal
Clay so I can use natural shaped materials without forcing them into
calibrated forms. Is it necessary for me to feel lesser than because
I choose to do so?

I know there are more urgent issues before us, there is no real
argument here, why turn it into one?

Peace, love and of course hugs.
Terrie