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Opinions on fissure filled stones

my husband and I had that argument last night, when he asked what had
me glued to my emails. whether a firestorm, meteorite, lightening or
anything else it’s heat treated. He said then if it’s colored from a
fire that isn’t natural, I asked him when he determined lightening to
be manmade.

For anyone following this thread, there was a post by John Dyer. I
recommend to everyone to visit his site at johndyergems.com to get a
perspective…and view some spectacular and stunning gems carved and
faceted by Mr. Dyer.

Richard Hart G.G.
Denver, Co. 80210

The buying public is for the mos part romanced by gemstones and what
they represent to them and the message communicated to society.
Enhancing or creating gems in a laboratory removes the mystique and
romance on the other hand taking advantage of technology has the
potential to reduce the pressure on the exploitation of natural
resources aleviate the blood factor in human terms and create jobs
so people can enjoy thier lives and have a cared for family.

goo

Just so I am understanding this correctly, the natural color of
tanzanite is brown? Well, how did they know it would turn out so
beautiful? 

Someone found a beautiful blue stone sticking out of the ground that
had been heated by God or Nature (take your choice). They then
proceeded to try to heat the brownish ones to see if they would
change color " and many of them did.

And then really, the value isn't the hardness? it's the rarity of
the color even if it's helped? 

Tanzanite is not a HARD stone. In fact most stone dealer recommend
that it not be used in rings. It also cannot be heated in an
ultrasonic, exposed to flame from a torch, cannot take sharp blows
like banging a ring on a counter top etc. It is the value of the
deep blue with purple color that makes it sort of rare and expensive.

As mentioned before " the color of many gemstones is HELPED. The
only question is if this treatment is reported to the buyer " or not.
Treating gemstones is legitimate and accepted " but it must be
disclosed to the buyer.

And not meaning to over simplify this, but a lot of the different
colored stones were colored because someone said "hey what if we do
this to it?" 

You can be absolutely sure that if some material comes out of the
ground and is not already beautiful " then the mine owners or the
stone dealers will try every possible method of treating it to make
it more beautiful and thus more sellable.

There is a big controversy about Copper diffused Andesine and now
doubts about Tourmaline " that has surfaced in the past year or so.
It seems that the stone dealers in Thailand have been very innovative
in finding new ways to treat gem stones. Unfortunately they
neglected to disclose these treatments to the buying public.

And really, (what do you call a person who does all this to a
stone?) it's a crap shoot, a geological grab bag? 

I guess they are called Treaters.

With the expense of mining gemstones and the fact that only about 5%
of the material that comes out of the mines is naturally beautiful "
you can be sure that the mine owners or stone dealer will be trying
any possible treatment to make the rest of the material in some way
saleable.

OK, someone said to me once that topaz from Texas was too light
and wasn't popular, so that was kinda BS, since it can be treated
to turn it, correct? 

The Mason County Topaz is very highly esteemed by the Texas natives
" especially if cut into the Texas Lone Star. Unfortunately there is
not much of it coming out of the ground " thus the need to Treat
clear topaz to make it Blue.

As mentioned, there is also some natural light blue Topaz coming out
of Brasil " but not in any considerable quantity. Of course the
nicest Topaz from Brasil is the natural Imperial Topaz " which is
relatively quite pricey.

In the beginning Clear Topaz was treated with Cobalt 60 Gamma
Irradiation and turned Sky Blue and a sort of Grayish London Blue.
Over time the treaters developed new processes using Nuclear
Radiation and Linear accelerators " as well as Heat " and thus Swiss
Blue, Electric Blue and quite a few other blue colors were made.
These colors penetrate completely through-out the stones.

The Aqua-Aura and Mystic Topaz (and many other names) is made by a
coating placed on the faceted stone " and depending upon the process
it is not scratch resistant. These stones cannot be re-polished " as
the clear topaz under the coating will be exposed.

So then is ametrine, half treated and half untreated amethyst? 

Natural Ametrine is made in the ground by God or Nature (take your
choice). If you or anyone tries to Heat only half a piece of
Amethyst " they will get a WHOLE citrine stone. There is no way to
heat half a stone and have it stay intact or not change color on the
whole stone.

And so the difference between light and darker Tanzanite is the way
the stone took the heating? 

No it is the quality of the rough material " darker Tanzanite is
more intensely colored naturally and heats to a better color.

And it doesn't come out of the ground that way at all? 

Of course some Tanzanite comes out of the ground already heated by
God or Nature (take your choice) and is blue. That is how Tanzanite
was discovered in the first place " someone found a beautiful blue
stone sticking out of the ground. Tanzanite also comes out of the
ground Green.

Best regards,
Robert P. Lowe Jr.

I've not heard of any test that can be done to a colored stone
that came out of the ground a given color (one or more) that can
determine if the color was that color when the stone formed or if
the color is a result of the stone undergoing a heating session
while still in the ground. 

There are many different tests that can be performed upon different
gem materials. Some of the tests can be performed with ease, some
need particular gemological tools, while others require extensive and
very expensive laboratory equipment. and even with all of this
available to us, and new testing procedures being developed
regularly, there are still treatments that are undetectable.

The good news is that with a few easy to use pieces of equipment
many treatments, simulations, and synthetics can be recognized
without much difficulty. I will not attempt to list them here. GIA,
AGA, IGTA, and other jewelry organizations can assist those that
desire more

The bad news is that there is no miracle test. Too bad huh.

Mike DeBurgh, GJG
Henderson, NV

Hello Debra,

I’m joining this thread late because nobody so far has po= inted out
the major drawback to glass filling. There is a big difference
between an Emerald filled with resin or oil and a glassed Ruby. The
Rubies that are usually subjected to this treatment have huge voids
and fissures rather than the comparatively minor cracks and veils
that are common in Emeralds. The difference in appearance between an
untreated Ruby and a glass filled one can be exceptionally dramatic.
A treated Emerald is merely improved. A $30 carat, heavily treated
Emerald will look like rubbish, a similarly priced glassed Ruby will
look like a gemstone. How they stand up to normal wear and tear is
another matter entirely.A treated Emerald will withstand normal wear
and tear in much the same way as an untreated one. An exception being
that oiling can be removed with prolonged immersion in harsh
detergents. This however can be easily and cheaply remedied.

A glass filled Ruby is seriously different being a mixture of the
soft glass and the hard Ruby and will wear in much the same way as
any glass stone in the glass parts leaving the Ruby parts proud.
Without any magnification the surface will look rough and crumbly
within a few months of use in a constantly worn ring. It gets worse
because often the filling is a Borax glass that has no resistance to
acids, even weak ones like lemon juice and vinegar. It is also
easily removed with a jewellers buff leaving an etched like
appearance on the stone. Unrealistically cheap is usually an
indicator of abundance. The rarity of this quality Ruby is only
comparative in the abrasive market where you can buy a rail car full
a day if you have the need.Lastly I’m not too sure about the
opportunity. Glassed Rubies can cost anywhere from a few dollars a
carat to a couple of hundred and when compared side by side the price
difference can be seen and justified. Either way the appearance is
only temporary if the stone is being put into jewellery. My opinion
is based on having to restore many of these stones and I’m well into
the hundreds. My customer base is entirely local and Vancouver isn’t
that big so I’m sure that gem cutters across the continent are
experiencing the same repair requests.

I would strongly suggest that if you want a Ruby then you should buy
a Ruby. I would much rather have a few points of the genuinearticle
than carats of poor substitute that has no magic, no soul.

Tony.
Anthony Lloyd-Rees.
TheGemDoctor.com

There is a big controversy about Copper diffused Andesine and now
doubts about Tourmaline " that has surfaced in the past year or
so. It seems that the stone dealers in Thailand have been very
innovative in finding new ways to treat gem stones. Unfortunately
they neglected to disclose these treatments to the buying public. 

Hmmmm, I bought my daughter an Andesine ring, my husband hated the
gold setting, said it looked cheap. But I was intriqued by the stone

quantity. Of course the nicest Topaz from Brasil is the natural
Imperial Topaz " which is relatively quite pricey. 

Tearing up boxes looking for my two stones of imperial topaz
Everything all of you tell me I take it to heart strongly, at 50 I
just can’t seem to get enough, I have never had much in life I had to
grow up fast and anyway I havent had much access to anything remotely
close to what Hanu has started here, I am grateful everyday to have
stumbled on this group of people, and I will not be setting any of my
tanzanite in ring settings, gonna leave that to someone else. and
please don’t think anyone is ever rambling on going on too long for
me, I am hypnotized seriously by the I am FINALLY
getting. I think I know how a person stranded in the desert feels
about water, this has (to some degree) satified my thirst to know, I
just want more and more the more I learn. Believe or not I am
actually trying to make a reference folder with all these emails,
lol. storing each email under subject, my poor husband got so mad at
me the other day, because I didn’t want to go out and eat I was too
busy reading all the emails. He’s close to retirement (after 40 yrs
he says 9yrs is close) and he believes in me and wants to be a part
of all this buthe doesn’t have the fever like I do, I am so excited
though he just said he needs to get truck ready to haul me to
TUCSON!!!

If you love colored gems there is no place like Tucson. Sounds a
little like Dorothy’s line but you won’t get there just by saying it
three times and tapping your emerald slippers. :wink:

In Tucson during the show there are more gems in more varieties in
more cuts than anywhere else on earth. It is mind blowing and
fascinating. If you can go do, you will like it!

John Dyer

the funny thing here is , I was just thinking over morning brunch
about an emerald I had seen locally, that is priced at about
$20,000, if I remember correctly it was 2 cts? it was a nice size,
anyway, totally flawed, just one big piling of fissures, light in
color. untreated abviously and my husband was floored over the
price,lol.

Anyway this thread had me thinking, why the high price without some
sort of treatment on it and here you are with my answer waiting ,lol.
I wear my “good stuff” on special occasions, so all of the expensive
jewelry I have is nice still. But I see family members wearing
wedding rings and other things while daily routines are being done. I
got onto my daughter-in-law about it and she is in the habit of
taking it off now, but it does concern me as far as who will get what
of my stuff. I have several pieces that are going to be worth some
money in the generations to come (I hope), and also when I start
selling again I want a customer base that has a selection, but also
educated about what they buy from me, on wear and tear, and the care.
I have cringed over a girlfriend who has rings on most of her fingers
and never takes them off, I also informed her I wasn’t repairing them
because she’s so hard on her jewelry, I am realizing more and more
the ignorance of how delicate some of these beauties can be, most
people think gemstone means unbreakable. And (ashamedly) I admit I
was one of them, til I really started studying and then found ya’ll.

I remember when I made saddles, I used a ruby cutter, It had slipped
my mind. Yes the soul or life that I can see in the real thing is
what has me mesmerized about all of this, I was told I would have
made a sorry short lived fish, lol, one shiny lure and I would have
been dinner.

Thank you so much for asking your questions!! I have the same queries, and the more I work & practice, the more questions I have! :thinking::+1: