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Gold solder


#1

Hi DeDe and all:

I also like Myron Toback but had a problem with their 20Kt.
solder. Where do you get your high karat gold solder? I’ve used
Hoover and Strong and they’re OK.

Maybe others will share solder sources:-).

Thanks.

Linda
@Red1Eagle


#2

Dear Linda and the rest of the gang:

A friend of mine sold me some 14K and 18K gold solder that she
bought from Hoover & Strong. According to her and a teacher of
mine, Hoover and Strong makes the best gold solder…I just WISH
I could find a local source. Sometimes you can’t wait to mail
order something…If you find another source in NYC, please let
me know!!!

DeDe

DeDe Sullivan
Producer
Manhattan Transfer Graphics
Tel: 212-907-1204
FAX: 212-370-9346
E Mail: @dede


#3

solder try united you must buy a lot of solder 10 dwts. most of
the tool houses sell it the phone 1800 999-fine
jack


#4
 A friend of mine sold me some 14K and 18K gold solder that
she bought from Hoover & Strong. According to her and a teacher
of mine, Hoover and Strong makes the best gold solder. >>

Personally, I’m more concerned with the added chemicals that
solder contains than its flow characteristics. After realizing
the dangers of cadmium, I started buying cadmium free solders.
Then I found out that the manufacturers were using indium as a
substitue, also dangerous. Now I buy solder from Khron
manufacturing in New Jersery; they use cadmium and indium free
chemicals to make their solder. The flow characteristics are
different, sometimes takes a little prodding to get it to move.
However, until I find out that there is another poisonous
chemical being used in their solder, I will stick with them. If
anyone is interested in their address, let me know.

regards, Allan Freilich


#5

if anyone is interested in their address, let me know.

Please! I bet I am not the only one!

Karen
@Karenworks


#6

Personally, I’m more concerned with the added chemicals that
solder contains than its flow characteristics. After realizing
the dangers of cadmium, I started buying cadmium free solders.
Then I found out that the manufacturers were using indium as a
substitue, also dangerous. Now I buy solder from Khron
manufacturing in New Jersery; they use cadmium and indium free
chemicals to make their solder. The flow characteristics are
different, sometimes takes a little prodding to get it to move.
However, until I find out that there is another poisonous
chemical being used in their solder, I will stick with them. If
anyone is interested in their address, let me know.

Dear Allan:

I would like to have the number for your source. I have the
same concerns as you do about dangerous chemicals. However, in
our line of work most of what we work with is dangerous to us and
the planet…It really sucks!!! But I try to make trade offs
whenever I can…

DeDe
DeDe Sullivan
Producer
Manhattan Transfer Graphics
Tel: 212-907-1204
FAX: 212-370-9346
E Mail: @dede


#7

De DE, Do silver solders contain cadmiums or just gold?


#8

De DE, Do silver solders contain cadmiums or just gold?

I have no idea… This is good question for John Burgess !!

DeDe Sullivan
Producer
Manhattan Transfer Graphics
Tel: 212-907-1204
FAX: 212-370-9346
E Mail: @dede


#9

<< De DE, Do silver solders contain cadmiums or just gold? >>

Not De De, but it seems that SOME silver solders contain
cadmiums (or however one spells it) and others don’t. Before you
order, check the specs. Better safe than sorry . . .


#10

De DE, Do silver solders contain cadmiums or just gold?
I have no idea… This is good question for John Burgess !!

G’day; Thank you DeDe for your faith in me, but I have to tell
you that I don’t know either! I checked through my books and
they don’t even mention cadmium in solders; Sharr Choate gives
recipes but simply uses varying quantities of brass for different
melting solders without mentioning the composition of the brass.
An alloying metal used in gold and silver solders to reduce
melting temperatures is usually zinc, but I do remember reading
somewhere about cadmium being used also for that purpose. Others
of my books do give zinc as a melting-point-reducing metal but
don’t mention cadmium in that context. I took a piece of my own
(Johnson Matthey) solder, dissolved it in nitric acid and tested
for the presence of cadmium but couldn’t find any. However, I
would suggest that the percentage of cadmium in a solder would
be low, and if one didn’t heat too strongly or for too long, and
didn’t breathe in the fumes (if any), the effect of cadmium in
solder wouldn’t be all that bad. If you’re really worried, you
should ask the maker if the solder contains cadmium. And that’s
really as far as I can go. I’m NOT infallible; barely human at
times! But Cheers, –

        /\
       / /    John Burgess, 
      / /
     / //\    @John_Burgess2
    / / \ \
   / (___) \
  (_________)

#11
  I checked through my books and they don't even mention
cadmium in solders; Sharr Choate gives recipes but simply uses
varying quantities of brass for different melting solders
without mentioning the composition of the brass. An alloying
metal used in gold and silver solders to reduce melting
temperatures is usually zinc, but I do remember reading
somewhere about cadmium being used also for that purpose.
Others of my books do give zinc as a melting-point-reducing
metal but don't mention cadmium in that context. I took a
piece of my own  (Johnson Matthey) solder, dissolved it in
nitric acid and tested for the presence of cadmium but
couldn't find any. However, I would suggest that the
percentage of cadmium in a solder would be low, and if one
didn't heat too strongly or for too long, and didn't breathe
in the fumes (if any), the effect of cadmium in solder
wouldn't be all that bad.

Hi John,

All silver-copper-alloys between silver 80/- and silver 912/-
have the same solidus temperature - 779 C. Alloys over 912/-
have solidus points between 779 C and 961.9 C. So, to get solders
for silver alloys, you need to add another metal to bring the
melting range down as the liquidus of the solder should be lower
than the solidus of the silver alloy (another aim is to keep the
melting range, i.e. the difference between solidus and liquidus
as narrow as possible). This can be done with zinc and cadmium,
and when they are used together, the melting range is brought
down even more than when using one of them alone. I have never
come across a silver solder with more than about 680 thousandths
of silver. Therefore, you shouldn’t use a lot of solder with
your pieces, or you will bring down silver content, and perhaps
violate law (they sell silver 935/- here for use as sterling to
make up for this).

Something you might have observed is that, when you heat up
solder with a sharp, oxidizing flame, there are very small
fuzzes, like miniature aspen seeds, flying around. These are
brown pieces of cadmium oxide or white zinc oxide.

Regarding health hazards, I’ve never heard of a bench goldsmith
with cadmium intoxication, and I think the cause for it being
banned from use by dentists here has more to do with what
happens in the mouth of the patient. On the other hand, zinc
isn’t too healthy, too, and I suspect that any substitute for
cadmium is equally noxious, only not yet researched as well.

I’ve got some recipes for silver solder without cadmium which I
give here, but I didn’t try them myself.

very hard: 601.6 g silver, 267.4 g copper, 30 g zinc, makes
silver 669/-;

hard: 601.6 g silver, 267.4 g copper, 60 g zinc, makes silver
648/-;

middle: 601.6 g silver, 267.4 g copper, 90 g zinc, makes silver
627/-;

easy: 601.6 g silver, 267.4 g copper, 120 g zinc, makes silver
608/-;

hard: 680 thou silver, 265 thou copper, 55 thou zinc;

middle: 640 thou silver, 250 thou copper, 110 thou zinc;

easy: 600 thou silver, 235 thou copper, 165 thou zinc;

very easy: 560 thou silver, 220 copper, 220 thou zinc;

Be careful when using brass for alloying, I wouldn’t do. Brass
for turning has lead (!) in it to harden it.

Hope this is of use for you, Markus