Ecommerce and Repairs

Jewelry Discussion
21

On this subject I don’t know but when it comes to fixing cheap junk
jewelry I try to avoid it. Foil thin or just excessivly hollowed out
mountings that collapse whe you try to bend them just makes me
crazy. I know I should be able to whip out sizings in five minutes
but this junk forces you to slow down and you can’t charge more for
it. On second thought I guess you can charge more but it’s just one
more thing on a long list of stuff to watch out for. I find it takes
up too much space in my thinking when I should be focusing on what I
do best…where I can really make money. Not being a repair
specialist I suppose I might find this stuff easier to deal with if I
was knee deep in it. That scenario kind of forces you to find
shortcuts and you develop the finesse that allows a bit more
profitability…in truth I’d rather just make cool custom
mountings where I control the quality and just forget the rest of
the gum machine stuff.

Charles

22

I posted this question before and didn’t really get any answers. I
agree wholeheartedly about the mass manufactured junk, but being a
faceter and a jeweler-wannabe I don’t know the difference between
mass mfg and non-mass mfg. I can easily see the difference in stones
because it’s my area of expertise, but not in castings, etc. What is
the distinguishing things that mark something as ‘mass produced
junk’ as opposed to just ‘mass produced’? Is it poor design or poor
casting/fabrications (I guess that would be obvious) or other
things?

Someone mentined about possibly having to rebuild a setting, etc,
what would cause this? Prongs too thin to be soldered, or?

Craig
www.creativecutgems.com

23 
Do _you_ do repairs on this type of product, Noel?

I did preface my remarks with “it seems to me…”

No, I repair only my own work, which means I really don’t do
repairs. So maybe that should stop me from having, or expressing, an
opinion. But it doesn’t!

Noel

24

I was asked to replace a stone for a ring purchased on E-Bay for
$5.00 The stone was a free form coral, I had to hunt for one that
fit the bezel, put that in, and repair the one on the other side
which was about to fall out too. I neglected to “quote” the job
first. So, the person who brought the ring in was SHOCKED at the
$25.00 price for the repair and has never picked it up. Although, she
sent me a nasty letter from the legal firm where she works. I suppose
I was to replace the stone for a couple of pennies. Darn, guess I
screwed up.

25

David Geller and Neil,

Very well said to both of you. I am building a business based on
repairs of everything I can feasable do. It’s working and I have a
nice customer base building already.

As for the rest of the posts…Thanks for the business.

Mark

26

Hi all,

I have made it my policy not to tackle repairs (jobbing work), or if
I do, I do them at cost as a favour. It is expected of me. I often
say that I only work on my own jewellery. I know it puts people off,
but I am busy enough not doing the work I don’t want to do.

I really appreciate the view expressed here: that though you can’t
control the quality of the large manufacturers (the big guy), but you
can make a profit from them.

There is money to be made from repairs. Not a lot of jewellers like
doing them, but there is no reason why somebody shouldn’t. It is
stress free work. People need their jewellery repaired, and somebody
has to do it. There are some excellent ‘jobbing’ specialists and it
is a skill that requires a lot of experience, eg: dealing with past
repairs - lead, extra easy solder, rebuilding settings fast and
effective, etc.

I tend not to take a repair from someone who bought their ring
elsewhere. I don’t think they want to hear my opinion, so I don’t get
asked that much, however I can be convinced for sentimental reasons
and don’t care to tell people what is worth fixing or not. I think
that the crux of the matter is that although you can still achieve
your required bench rates the amount of repairs and how they look
when they go out can adversely affect the reputation of the work you
do. I believe that looking busy makes you busy and looking like a
busy setter makes you a busy setter and so fourth. That is, if you
have to do more repair work then manufacture (where you can control
the quality) then not as many people will be able to talk about the
pieces you want to represent yourself by.

It is very interesting to hear the views of the contributors. I
rarely hear people say they like doing repairs but it happens and to
hear that doing them brings in better work, sounds great.

I personally try to turn away the work I don’t want to do because
there are too many jewellers around me that will do the work and some
that are quite good repair specialists (especially jobbing setters).
I actually find it hard to switch from repair work to setting, to
hand modelling, making settings etc, (even changing metals after a
time). If I am working on a repair I can’t help thinking about how
much better the piece would look if it wasn’t so constrained
especially if the efforts are times staking.

I am not talking about heirloom pieces or sentimental items. It is
just that important pieces need a lot of care and are not general
’repair’ items. I think if you can gain good work from general
repairs then that suggests that you have a good customer base.

Phillip

27

I have been following this thread and while I did respond once, I am
doing it again. I will admit to taking in some of this stuff over the
years to gain a new customer, since often it is a “test”. Many times
I will suggest a new mounting or I wil tell them that I can repair it
but it will cost XXX amount of dollars. Sometimes, due to sentiment,
they will go ahead and have me repair the item. If I think I cannot
do a decent job, I will either turn the job away ( last resort) or
call out for one of my other jeweler pals who may be set up to do
the job faster. In the past, I have been quite busy with enough
custom work that I havn’t felt the need to take on these often
frustraiting, low profit or risky repair jobs. Things sometimes
change but I wish the junk would all go away…apparently, its not
happening anytime soon. For the unschooled out there, just be
carefull what you promise and make the customer aware of the risks
involved so they may make an informed decision. I know I appreciate
hearing the straight scoup when I am having my auto repaired.
Sometimes this means buying a new /different car. When I am informed
and its my decision, I am o.k. with paying or assessing the worth of
repairing or not. Just put yourself in your customers shoes and
you’ll know what to do.

charles

28

Let me clarify my position on “average” repairwork a bit. I did my
time - 37 years. Mostly as a tradeshop, but some years of retail too.
Shed buckets of blood, sweat, and a few tears too.

Now, I’ve been somewhat forced by circumstances to change my
priorities and simplify my life. The first thing I chose to get rid
of was the retail storefront. The second was to absolutely minimize
the repair work. Those are MY choices. I am very lucky in that I had
this option. Your mileage may vary. You may have to do these things -
or you may love the doing those particular aspects. I don’t and I
didn’t. Maybe I was burned out? No truthfully, I WAS!

I’ve chosen not to teach the general bench repairs because it’s a
much tougher occupation these days than it was in my heyday and I
don’t really want anyone thinking that it isn’t. There seems to be no
shortage of people willing to take on the task, and more power to
them. it’s always better to be young and optimistic than old and
cynical:) So I am told anyway, every day, by my wife.

I do teach a “restoration” workshop once a year, mostly for
collectors of old Spratling, Jensen, and similar pieces but that is
specialty stuff. I do it for nostalgia reasons, as well as a personal
interest.

You can still build a set of repair skills from the soldering,
fabrication, setting, and finishing workshops I offer. I just removed
the specialized " jewelry repair" workshop which concentrated on ring
sizings, chain soldering, prongs, tipping, half shanks and the like.

On a forum of this kind you are quite free to push the delete
button, or argue the pros and cons of it your hearts content. I’ve
already done that argued with myself - and made the decision to
remove some aggravation from my life.

I’m quite content making a few pieces that will be around long after
I am gone, and teaching some workshops once in a while. Whoever wants
the repairs or wants to teach people to do it and get the fortune it
may bring them (along with the attendant troubles), is more than
welcome to it!

As to taking in repairs through a website - it may work? Personally,
the difficulties I can see with that make my skin crawl but that’s
just me.

I myself may one day put up a studio website not so much to seek
sales - as for a showcase and contact point. I doubt that I would
ever have reason to enter web commerce in a serious way, but I see
nothing wrong with it. My rant was specific to those who sell crap.

I’m finally feeling a little tiny bit in control of my life again.
I’m actually producing work, after almost 4 years off.

Brian P. Marshall
Stockton Jewelry Arts School
Stockton, CA USA
209-477-0550

29

Dear David,

Since I first brought up this subject I am amazed at the breadth of
the responses. You, Richard Hart and Dan Spirer seem to have the
best grasp and most level headed approaches to the problem. On the
one hand you gain nothing by being confrontational and on the other
hand you have everything to gain when you steer the customer to
quality while educating him. The key word here is education !

The public doesn’t usually know squat about quality and value. It has
been conditioned to have a knee jerk response to price. But, the
really important consideration is the fact that the LOCAL brick and
mortar seller is there to back up his product, tell you how to
discern quality in workmanship and stone grades and, most important
of all, back up his product. When people buy by price alone they
forsake the opportunity to inspect the goods, the benefit of the
wisdom of the local seller and the availability of the seller to
rectify any doubts or claims. With respect to the last
consideration, suppose you live in California and you have an issue
with a seller who operates out of New York ? How do you go about
satisfying your dissatisfaction with a particular transaction. You
can e-mail the ethereal seller and hope for the best. Or, you can go
to court…but where ? What legal jurisdiction is relevant…yours
or theirs. And, if you get a judgement, how do you go about getting
satisfaction from afar AND, outside your jurisdiction, HOW THE HELL
DO YOU COLLECT ?

We are not going to settle this issue on this forum, but it behooves
us to consider the issues involved. I did a superficial survey of
the volume of the e-commerce purveyors’ volume of business according
to the National Jeweler and it suggested that e-commerce is the
predominant purveyor of jewelry in America. Somehow we independent
jewelers are going to have to figure out how we are going to adapt to
the new realities and deal with them accordingly. My take on the
issue is that we MUST make every effort to educate our customers as
to the pitfalls of doing business on the web with anonymous “here
today and gone tomorrow” purveyors. If you don’t have accountability
you can do just about anything you wish…!

The real issue here is that we independent jewelers must come up to
the plate (bad analogy here, considering the fact that we are an
international forum…Americans relate “coming up to the plate” as
being the point at which baseball players try to hit the ball…sorry
about that ! ) Back to the point…marketing is the ultimate
challenge, and we MUST educate our customers…we have to point out
to them that dealing locally is the better alternative if, for no
other reason, it is the REASONABLE thing to do.We have to preach to
them and we have to make every effort to sell them on the fact that
dealing anonymously abroad is a risky venture !. We are at a
crossroads…we can let the hucksters overwhelm us or we can stand
our ground !

Ron at Mills Gem Co. Los Osos,Ca

30

Hi Craig,

The main problem with mass produced junk, as you put it, is the
skimping on metal to save money. They are so light weight that when a
piece comes in for repair, there is a lack of structure to work with.
They also use a mold so many times and pull waxes so fast that the
piece is often distorted and impossible to straighten out. Also, the
junk is made to look like a designer piece but only on the surface;
invisible set rings are a good example of this. They only look like
the real thing and fall apart easy if you try to resize or repair
anything on them. A lot of chains look heavy but are hollow, they
melt easy, dent easy and suck up solder when you go to repair them.
There are quality “mass produced” items such as the Tiffany lines and
various designers lines. They too wear out, like tires on a car, but
the difference is like night and day, it’s a treat to repair a well
made piece.

Marta

31

Way to go, Brian !

I can’t say that I blame you at all for taking the stand that is
best for you. On the other hand, those of us who are still “in the
trenches” doing daily battles with poorly informed customers do not
have the luxury of making ourselves scarce. Nonetheless, just
recently I had the opportunity of telling a customer that I could
not change the battery in his watch because it was too filthy. You
would be appalled at the number of people there are who NEVER take
off their watches. In this case, not only did the customer never take
off his watch, it was readily apparent that he may have never bathed
!!! I was braced for a hurtful and angered response, but the man
simply asked me how he should go about cleaning it and he came back a
half hour later with a shiny, clean watch ! So, not only do we have
to educate our customers but we also have to provide them with the
missing early toilet training…ah, the life of the little merchant
! Who ever said it was going to be easy?. ( Some jewelers do escape
the mundane, however…A good friend of mine,who is a master
jeweler, came in yesterday to announce that he had decided to go on
the net and operate his business from a ninety five foot sailing
yacht somewhere in the South Pacific. He is building a workshop
aboard. He is also a master watchmaker so he will be accepting major
jewelry commissions, repairing multi k watches and hustling the
yachties who loll about in every Pacific port. My friend is at that
time of life when people look back on their dreams and go for the
gusto pursuing outrageous endeavours…some of us make it and most
of us don’t !)

Ron Mills, Mills Gem Co.Los Osos, Ca.

32

There is a problem here & that is that there are far to many other
things to spend money on than jewelry. A customer lost to or burned by
e-commerce is likely to not be a jewelry customer at all! Burned and
shy about getting burned again, so will go somewhere else the next
time they need a gift. I won’t repair “that” sounds like more of a
put-down to many people, than an evaluation of the jewelry. Please
find a way to keep them interested in jewelry.

Mark Chapman

33 
The key word here is education !

And there it is! This conversation seems to be isolated to well
seasoned, well worn craftsmen. May I chime in as a formerly
frustrated customer? My bench lit up later in life so I can speak
from the “other side of the counter.” I once took a test piece (a
gold and opal ring given to my 8 y/o from grandma) in to a jeweler
to switch out a stone. I was not only told no but endured a lengthy
lecture on the cheap demeaning labor of diamond setters overseas.
Guilt trip included free of charge. That rapport test failed
miserably. I picked up my jaw and left.

Next ring, next jeweler. I took in my own 4 prong semi-mount and my
own stone. The final cost was $80. He notched and did a perfect job
but it was his personality that sold me. He became my jeweler because
he took the time to get up from his bench, flip up his eye protection
and establish rapport with me. If he was put off by this redundant
service, I never detected it. Now that I’m a maker, I send him
customers that I’m not ready to tackle.

34

Dear Jaye ( and Mark ),

How right you both are ! We jaded old guys need to sometimes have a
refresher course in human relations. There are ways and there are
ways. Bashing the customers baubles is NOT the way, but, you can
point out the problems that might be encountered in performing a
given task and, if the case may be, tell the customer that you can’t
be responsible if things don’t go well. Sometimes you might have to
suggest that the item has lived a complete life and deserves a
dignified burial: then you have the opportunity of suggesting that
the item can be melted down and put into a more lasting icon.
Negativity is positively not necessary. We all have our bad days and
we all need to avoid transference of our occaisional bad karma !

Ron Mills, Mills Gem Co. Los Osos, Ca.

35 
It is stress free work. People need their jewellery repaired, and
somebody has to do it.

I just had to return on this statement, having just spent two most
stressful days working on repairs which nearly ended up on the
street under my open window. All the most s****y repairs in the city
had hung around and decided to come as a group to my bench and have a
party. Someone heard me say last week that I really enjoy this job…

Ruth in the UK.

36 
It is stress free work. People need their jewellery repaired, and
somebody has to do it.

Yep, somebody has to do it.

“Stress free?” Mebee so… where you live and work… NOT at any
shop on this planet that I’ve ever visited or worked!

It does however, force you to become an incredible problem solver.
Just don’t get sucked in, as I did so many times. Trying to prove
that you CAN fix it - because “nobody else can.”

Look very, very carefully at any job that another bench jeweler has
refused. It ain’t always 'cause his or her skill level isn’t high
enough… mostly I’ve found that it was because they were smarter
than I was!

Brian

37

Brian,

How right you are ! Just today I proceeded to do a simple sizing job
on an old ring containing a bezel set ten point diamond and three.05
ct. rubies. I did the sizing job and somewhere along the line the
diamond disappeared. I went to my oops stash and replaced the diamond
after doing the usual futile butt up floor search. Then I went to the
buff and proceeded to restore the ring to its’ former glory, which
actually produced holy glory, that special form of sanctification
that miraculously creates holes in the metal. Somehow one of the
three.05 ct. rubies had vanished into thin air ! After close scrutiny
I determined that the missing ruby resulted from an impact that had
laid over the four prongs. Now what I was faced with is reseating the
replacement.ruby so that the prong wear was compensated. All this for
a lousy sizing job ! Moral of the story…NEVER take in a simple
job without considering ALL of the ways that it can go wrong ! I
always try to be very competitive with repairs, but I am beginning to
think that there should be a very drastic differentiation of price
structuring between new merchandise and that which is old or worn. It
is kind of like the old analogy of" You can’t make a silk purse out
of a sow’s ear" ( Unless you charge the hell out of it ! )

Ron Mills, Mills Gem Co.
Los Osos, Ca.

38

Hi

When I opened my first jewelry store back in 1992 there was this
jeweler around the corner in a little store doing repairs for $2.00
and $3.00. We barely got any repairs and the few repairs we did get I
would just take it over to him to do. Well eventually I hired one of
his employees and started charging the same prices and business
started to pour in as this was a large jewelry store doing repairs
for $2.00 and finally got rid of the competition. Now we charge
anywhere form $10 to $ 30.00 for simple solders. I guess sometimes
you have to play the game and just be patient. we still get some
customers who don’t want to pay so we let them pay whatever they want
literally. I tell myself that I just paid for a classified add. Junk
jewelry is here and here to stay, we almost never turn down a job
our motto is if we can’t fix it no one can. Really we do the best we
can sometimes we win sometimes we loose, we prepare the customer as
to what he/she can expect and let him know that we are professionals
and will do the best we possibly can.

Its a dirty job but someone’s got to do it.

I once had a customer who brought me a ring he bought on the
internet 1/2 ct man’s ring in 14 Kt for $ 225.00 I could not believe
so he brought me the printout well I charged him $50.00 to size it I
made more money then the person who sold him the ring.

Gary
Did you guys read about the Jacob the jeweler? on JCK Monday newsletter.

39

Hi Brian;

Look very, very carefully at any job that another bench jeweler
has refused. It ain't always 'cause his or her skill level isn't
high enough... mostly I've found that it was because they were
smarter than I was!

Boy, Howdy, you said a mouthfull and I’ll second that. I sometimes
wonder how they saw, in advance, the misery I was about to invite
upon myself, or if they, in turning down the work, cursed it for the
next guy. Nice view out here, hey, what’s that sawing noise?

David L. Huffman

40

Ron,

This is not directed at you but instead is my recent experience I
had concerning doing repairs.

I love doing repairs. There is hidden money in repairs if you take
the time to look and look I do with every job that comes to me. I
never want to be put in the position of taking in a $20.00 to $30.00
repair job and have to give up a.05ct diamond that fell out.

Here is an example of a job I just finished. A very good long time
client came to me to have a ring sized that they just purchased on
eBay for $1200.00. This ring had a 2.25ct pale green Emerald that was
highly included and chipped along the girdle edge. The setting job
for the Emerald was terrible and all 4 prongs were pushing away from
the corner of the stone.

There was also 12 bead set round Diamonds and 4 prong set baguettes.
Four of the small Diamonds where chipped and 2 where ready to fall
out. Four of the remaining diamonds where loose.

Many jewelers would never take the time to look over a sizing job
like I do and they would have missed most of what was wrong or they
would have looked at it and refused the job.

I explained to the client everything that needed to be done and
showed them under my microscope. When all was said and done this
simple sizing job turned into a $400.00 repair job to remove the chip
in the Emerald, replace 4 prongs, replace 4 small diamonds, reset the
Emerald and 4 small diamonds, size the ring and tighten all the other
loss stones.

This client is thrilled with me and the time I spent with them
explaining everything that needed to be done.

If a piece of jewelry is worth $50.00 and it needs $100.00 worth of
repair work to make it correct then explain what needs to be done and
explain the risks involved. You may be surprised how often a client
says go ahead and do the work. Oh and by the way I understand that it
is a light weight piece and it may continue to cause problems in the
future but it is an important piece to me and my family.

Greg DeMark
greg@demarkjewelry
www.demarkjewelry.com