Alicia,
Look at it this way: A Chihuahua and a pit bull are both dogs,
although vastly different. Graphite and diamond are both carbon,
although vastly different. Soft coal and jet are both coal but
vastly different.
By the way, it’s Whitby, not Withby.
Jerry in Kodiak
Jet you do find there is apt to be something really special. Still, how many people want Jet? Can you make money with it? To prosper, or not to prosper?
This conversation has got me thinking about one of my projects, and
it does require a black stone for it to work out properly.
So we have jet, are there other black stones that are dead black?
I’m assuming that you can either polish the stones or leave them a
matte finish (which would be better for my purposes).
As to making money, well there’s potential, but that depends on the
target market.
Regards Charles A.
I guess it depends on the jeweler and their location. It seems to me Jet would fall into the 'curiosity' category. Having no appreciable intrinsic value, I personally wouldn't invest much time/material on spec. If I had a client who wanted something Jet custom, well that's a different thing.
When the very occasional piece of old Whitby jet carving comes up for
sale on the open market it usually fetches a high price - much higher
than a similar piece in a semi-precious stone such as agate, rock
crystal etc. would fetch and more in line with the price of our other
local ‘specialty mineral’, Blue John. Both Jet and Blue John do have a
high intrinsic value nowadays as neither is now mined on the fairly
large scale they once were and so supplies of the genuine material
are very limited. Add to this the large amount of handwork put into
early piece and you have the reason for the high value. I find the
term ‘intrinsic value’ somewhat meaningless - in relative terms a
ruby or sapphire has little intrinsic value until it is cut and
polished and then the majority of the value is in the type and
precision of the cut - the ‘added value’. Scrimshaw and cameos can
command high values at auction and yet that are made from materials
just picked up on the beach. The real value of a piece is in its
rarity and the way it is worked and true, old Whitby Jet scores high
on both counts…
Ian
Ian W. Wright
Sheffield UK
Black stones?
Off the top of my head…
Diamond Sapphire Tourmaline Pearl Onyx
Tony Konrath
So we have jet, are there other black stones that are dead black?
For a harder stone there’s always what they sell as black onyx but is
not onyx. It’s actually chalcedony that’s been treated with sulfuric
acid and sugar. The process turns a bluish gray stone dead black
that’s hard and takes a brilliant polish.
Rick Copeland
rockymountainwonders.com
It's a group of materials, not a single one, sharing a common general process of formation and a similar, though not identical, range of original material source, then modified by similar processes, but through quite a range of geologic times and conditions. It's all coal, but certainly not all coal is alike.
Results of an internet search, done on items found embedded in coal,
indicate that metal antiquities have been found inside chunks of
hard coal.
If it requires millions of years to form hard coal, then these
unusual discoveries may be evidence that there were advanced
civilizations (metalsmiths) on earth millions of years ago.
So we have jet, are there other black stones that are dead black?
Charles, I use ebony a lot for something similar to jet. It’s
expensive on the face of it, but for small jewelry things it works
out pretty cheap.
For hardstone, you’ve only got one real choice, which is black onyx.
Black jade is better and nicer, but it’s not “dead black” - it’s so
deeply green that it ~looks~ black, and you can see that in fragments
and flakes.
If it’s black enough for you, then it’s black enough. I prefer it be
cause it has a certain warmth that black onyx lacks. Or black
vitreous enamel…
I’ll try to referree Peter Rowe’s completely factual and accuate
post today and Alicia Webb’s post that’s the same, too. Yes, jet is
coal, technically, as Peter reminds us. I think it’s the same (as
others also hinted at) as with other things in life. We don’t call
diamond “carbon” in everyday usage - we don’t call jasper, agate or
onyx “quartz” in everyday usage.
These are the labels that help us communicate unique properties
without getting all technical every time we speak. Let Whitby have
their “jet” - it’s unique and special…
How about Black Jade - it works wonders and gets a good high polish.
I have obtained mine from Sweetwater in Prescott, AZ. Have never
checked for a website - just see him at his room in Tucson.
Rose Marie Christison
Chihuahua and a pit bull are both dogs, although vastly different. Graphite and diamond are both carbon, although vastly different. Hydrogen and Plutonium are both elements, although vastly different and Venus and Jupiter are both planets, although so vastly different that the fact that they are members of the same solar system is irrelevant.
This is not an argument. Jet is a form a fossilised wood. It’s not
because it’s black that it is coal. We do not call fossilised palm
tree coal either. Dino bone (organic and fossilised) is not coal.
When you saw through a piece of jet, it is not black, but brown like
turf. If you heat up a needle and poke it in the jet, it smells like
turf and not like coal. It only becomes black when you spit on it
(sorry, but this how I lubricate things), rub some oil on it from
your fingers or when you polish it.
I accept that jet will eventually end up being coal in a couple of
hundreds of thousands of years, but for now, jet is wood, not coal.
And as for the colour, all black stones always make me think of a
funeral, but jet is sensual; when polished it is the most beautiful
black I have ever seen. As for my spelling, it is a pleasant
tradition in this country to misspell all things English.
For hardstone, you've only got one real choice, which is black onyx.
Not true. Take a look at black spinel. It will run circles around
black onyx in each an every gem characteristic. It is absolute
black; much harder than onyx; and takes absolutely brilliant polish.
It is not as available as black onyx and therefore is not used in
mass production. For one of a kind work, it is an excellent choice.
Leonid Surpin
So we have jet, are there other black stones that are dead black?
Off the top of my head, the following black stones are generally
available:
Black Onyx, Obsidian, Schorl Tourmaline, Black Spinel, Black Diamond,
Black Star Sapphire, Hematite, Black Agate (various), Some Petrified
Palmwood, Black Jasper
Chip B
How about Black Jade - it works wonders and gets a good high polish. I have obtained mine from Sweetwater in Prescott, AZ.
Absolute Black “Jade” is gem grade ferro-hornblende and not a true
jade.
Richard Hart G.G.
Denver, Co. 80210
We do not call fossilised palm tree coal either. Dino bone (organic and fossilised) is not coal.
That’s because fossilized palm has been silicated. Dino bone is
either calcified or silicated. Coal and jet have gone through what’s
known as a carboniferous period where organic matter metamorphoses
into coal when plant matter is trapped in acidic water and/or mud. If
you hold a torch to a small piece of Jet it will eventually ignite
and burn. Mostly smolder but still burns and smells like a coal fire.
If it looks like a duck and quacks like a duck the it’s probably a
duck.
Rick Copeland
rockymountainwonders.com
I don’t know about artifacts in coal on this planet but I wonder if
one of the highly carbonized forms of matter we call coal might not
be formed in space somewhere without living creatures preceding it.
Bottom line - Is there any chemistry we do which nature cannot do
given a universe of > billions of stars x billions of planets. I read
a report once of a planet or planetoid made entirely of C - diamond.
True? False? If T, could it not be burned to CO2 and chemically
altered to become coal? In Andromeda maybe C-diamond is common and
C-coal is rare in nature so the jewellers are really keen on coal as
jewelry. Supply and demand.
An explosive impact, eg an asteroid crash landing can turn C of some
form into C diamonds. Why not C coal? If ET leaves his jewellers
loupe behind maybe it ends up as a coal-immersed space artifact, an
"inclusion" like those bugs in amber.
Somebody else mentioned immersion of rocks in sugarized sulphuric
acid to turn them black. So I put a piece of greyish-greenish stone
into sugarized muriatic acid overnight. So far it is working. It is
now a dark brown as is the acid bath.
Somebody else mentioned immersion of rocks in sugarized sulphuric acid to turn them black.
There are only two ways that I know of to induce black into
gemstone. One of these involves carbon while the other is silver.
Theoretically, there should be several other methods possible. I
have tested these out however, and they have proved impractical. But
black is black, so multiple means of inducing it are not needed. The
two presented here are different in that one, the silver, is black
with a metallic sheen or luster.
Charles
So we have jet, are there other black stones that are dead black?
I get truly spectacular natural black Spinel from
www.aussiesapphire.com
The stones, sold loose as beads & cabs, are beautifully faceted & a
deep endless black. Their prices reflect this. I spend slightly less
than a dollar a stone for 3-4mm faceted round beads & tumble polished
natural shape beads, but I feel that it is well worth it.
The owner, Leah Lane, is also a delight to work with.
Be well,
Do good work,
Cristine McC
So we have jet, are there other black stones that are dead black?
What about slate/schist? It exists in some beautiful satin matt
black and has a nice warm feel to the touch.
Hi Richard
This has been a very interesting subject. Just leave it to me to add
my 2 cents! HAHA
So…the really good black stuff that I get from Robert at Sweetwater
isn’t Jade at all. Thanks for letting me know the correct name.
Rose Marie Christison
Plain agates can be turned black if they are porous. Some stones
have porous and non-porous layers and these will end up striped.
Place the stone in a saturated solution of sugar in water and then
boil and cool it. Then place the stone in concentrated sulphuric
acid. Concentrated sulphuric acid is thick, viscous and oily - often
slightly yellow due to impurities.
The acid is hydroscopic and will “remove” the molecules of hydrogen
and oxygen in the sugar leaving behind the carbon. Then you need to
neutralize the acid remaining in the pores of the stone.
This is a dangerous procedure and should be attempted with all sorts
of precautions so I don’t recommend it be done in an ordinary
workshop. Fume hoods, gloves etc. are needed.
Tony Konrath
What about slate/schist? It exists in some beautiful satin matt black and has a nice warm feel to the touch.
or basalt. Sometimes very black. Lava can be jet black (Hawaiian
lava, for example, the source of the famous black sand beaches) I’ve
also seen some very pretty, kind of sparkly/crystaline building stone
that is a black granite. Not quite the jet black gem material, but
interesting nevertheless… Obsidian can be very dense black too. And
that’s just off the top of my head. More, I’m sure, is buried further
in…
Peter