I opened a container of Baldwin’s Patina that I got a couple of years ago. I tried it on cleaned copper per directions and it did nearly nothing. It did smell strongly of ammonia. Can this material die of old age? BTW the container was still sealed.
Penny
The solution can weaken over time. Try adding a drop or two of clear ammonia per ounce to the bottle to see if it becomes active again. If that doesn’t work try a wee bit more.
If it’s the 4 ounce bottle try it on a smaller amount to see if it works first. Maybe someone else has another idea on how to reactivate the solution.
Beyond that I don’t have any other recommendations.
As an alternative to Baldwin’s try some Ortho lime sulfur that is used for fruit trees. 1 part lime sulfur to 2 parts water, give or take. This is strong so you will have to experiment of course to find what works for you. Should be available at any larger nursery.
Be Well.
Thank you! I had never opened the Baldwin’s container and I was hoping it would do the trick. I don’t have ammonia on hand. I do have some lime sulfur spray that I use on my fruit trees, but I will have to go out to the farm to get it.
Penny
Phil Baldwin died, but his family and friends are keeping his business alive. I don’t think they’re selling his products through his website anymore, but you can contact them through his website to ask questions.
Rio Grande sells Baldwin’s Patina. You could try reaching out to their tech support team.
Reactive Metals was a strong supporter of keeping Phil’s business going. I don’t see that they carry Baldwin’s Patina, but they might either know the answer to your question or know who to ask.
Rio Grande has an SDS sheet on Baldwin’s Patina on their web site. Sometimes SDS sheets show a list of ingredients. Unfortunately, this one doesn’t.
I know this doesn’t answer your question, but maybe it will help lead to an answer.
Best of luck!!
Jeff
Thanks so much. I may try to reactivate with ammonia. I happened to order a new bottle from a supplier, it is out of stock at Rio and is no longer on the RMS website as a patina for sale although other patinas are for sale as is No Name Prep. The Shining Wave website is still up and the links still seem to work.
A close up view of a bottle on etsy indicated it was made at RMS and had ingredients of water, aqua ammonia, and copper salts. I am under the impression this is not a product that will be commercially available into the future.
Penny
Hi Penny,
After Phil passed away, we stopped offering the Baldwin’s Patina but now offer Ready Patina which is a slightly different configuration but works in the same way. Regarding your Baldwin’s, the above advice about adding a bit of ammonia is correct but listed shelf life is 1 year so if your bottle is 2 years old, it may have died. Steps to ensure a good color on copper and copper alloys for both Baldwin’s & Ready Patina: Clean first with No Name patina prep, rinse and run under warm water to heat your piece, then swab on with a sponge. Multiple swabs will increase the color.
I appreciate you taking the time to reply! If I am not able to revive the Baldwin’s Patina, I will order the Ready Patina.
Penny
Baldwin’s patina recipe
Hello Amy, you can mix this up yourself quite easily–I don’t
know the proportions, but I have made up my own batches that work
well without this being a problem.
Copper Chloride
Urea
Ammonia
Water
Stir together and enjoy....Marty R.
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
the recipe doesn't show the proportions... if there's a precipitate on the bottom of the bottom of the can, adding ammonia will dissolve it, turning the solution deep blue. Urea reacts with copper chloride and ammonia to form a deep blue complexed copper ion.. adding more urea should lighten the color.. urea breakdown is the most likely culprit.. it reacts with water to form more ammonia, water and carbon dioxide... the reaction is rapid.
Good info!
pb
I hope you could see the message… somehow it ended up on the bottom and you have to scroll through it. I forgot to say that added more urea could fix the problem… as urea is unstable when stored for a long time, adding more could fix the solution. Urea can be bought at chemical supply stores. reagent grade is expensive, everthing at a chemical supply store is. but you don’t need much of it… a quarter teaspoon in a quart of solution is a start…Purified urea will keep if it’s shielded from light and kept cool and dry. putting it in the freezer or refrigerator in an airtight container will help preserve it longer. It usually comes in a dark bottle but if not, the bottle can be covered with aluminum foil.