As we have seen through the course of this discussion, mail means
"net". Plate is a term used for body armour made from sheets of
metal, the term "platemail", does not work, and seemed to
originated when people started playing Dungeons and Dragons.
I’m pretty new to jewelry fabrication, but my previous life was as
an teacher - ESL and writing, specifically, with a MA in Applied
Linguistics. And this conversation is missing the boat in a few
different ways.
There are a few facts that we need to accept. First and foremost,
language is fluid. Meanings change. Words change. Languages change.
Prescriptive grammar, spelling, etc., is not and has never been part
of the English language. If you want bureaucratic, linguistic
precision, try French. L’Acad?mie fran?aise would be happy to help.
Secondly, words will mean what people want them to mean. To say that
“platemail does not work” and then to cite where precisely where the
term does “work” doesn’t make sense. If people who play DnD have
created a word and a concept and that word works its way into the
mainstream’s lexicon, then LANGUAGE IS DOING ITS JOB. The word DOES
work because people DO use it. Even people who don’t agree with the
“concept” of platemail still know what platemail means. The same goes
for chainmail, chainmaille, and, I suspect, chaineemailllee.
So to deny reality in favor of some non-existent Platonic language
standard is an enormous waste of time - that’s simply not how
languages work. Unless you have some sort of esoteric knowledge
concerning an objectively, morally correct language system that
we’re not aware of - perhaps by arguing that we should all reverse
the flow of time and to return to the use of Proto-Indo-European
because it pleases Zeus and will put us into ecstatic harmony with
nature and reality, then saying people “shouldn’t” use words that
EVERYONE KNOWS THE MEANING TO is an exercise in futility.
The word DOES work because people DO use it. Even people who don't
agree with the "concept" of platemail still know what platemail
means. The same goes for chainmail, chainmaille, and, I suspect,
chaineemailllee.
This is a bit unconstrained attitude towards language. English is my
second language, but I am somewhat acquainted with History of Edged
Weapons. I have a book in my library which is a dictionary english
terminology used in connection with Arms and Armor. The only word
that is used to describe armor made out of connected rings is MAIL.
Maille is used in classical literature in context of mail, but
maille is a word used to mean “rent”, “agreement”, “legal document”.
In another words it is mail in context of modern post office.
Mail used in context of armor comes from Scottish name for the
breast feather of a hawk. I suppose these feathers have some special
qualities, so when soldiers start wearing protection on their bodies
it was called mail. The only association to maille in context of
chainmail is a term maillet de fer, which means hammer of war. It
was invented in the same time period and was used to punch through
chainmail. It is not difficult to see that with time silent “t” was
dropped and maillet became maille, and chainmail became chainmaille.
That may be the accepted usage, but looking at word origin it is
clear that the only appropriate term is chainmail.
I'm pretty new to jewelry fabrication, but my previous life was as
an teacher - ESL and writing, specifically, with a MA in Applied
Linguistics. And this conversation is missing the boat in a few
different ways.
English Sign Language?
Even people who don't agree with the "concept" of platemail still
know what platemail means. The same goes for chainmail,
chainmaille, and, I suspect, chaineemailllee.
That’s a fair comment, and I did concede that point earlier.
This is where I’m coming from :- I talk to a lot of archaeologists,
and they’d be reeling, it’s just academia I guess. I also come from a
programming background where syntax and words have to be precise.
I'm pretty new to jewelry fabrication, but my previous life was as
an teacher
An teacher. Just for fun.
While I agree that this argument is mostly silly, and I’m fairly
sure no one who’s posted (so far) would jump across a counter and
shake a customer by the neck if they put a chain before a mail…
Since this is a forum of professionals/vested enthusiasts, I’d say
that an argument based on, “language changes, get used to it” is far
more senseless than a debate of proper terminology as it was used in
the middle ages, Victorian times, or last week’s D&D game.
I’ve even learned a couple things in this thread! I always thought
adjective-mail was coined by Dungeons and Dragons, I had no idea it
was Victorian in origin.
As it stands though, I’d probably use chain mail as a matter of
convenience, unless I was marketing such a product to LARP, SCA, or
Ren-Faire folks who I’d expect to know the difference.
As it stands though, I'd probably use chain mail as a matter of
convenience, unless I was marketing such a product to LARP, SCA,
or Ren-Faire folks who I'd expect to know the difference.
You are very correct it does depend who you are marketing to,
re-enactors or SCA re-enactors, for example can be very picky groups
to deal with.
I know a lot of people in both camps, in general a re-enactor can be
more anal than an SCA re-enactor. This has to be taken into
consideration when selling to these markets.
As there are terminologies in any market group, there are
terminologies in these re-enactor market groups also.
It’s beneficial to know your market’s terminology.
Mail used in context of armor comes from Scottish name for the
breast feather of a hawk.
It does? Google “mail etymology.”
Here’s one: “metal ring armor,” early 14c., from O.Fr. maille “link
of mail, mesh of net,” from L. macula “mesh in a net,” originally
“spot, blemish,” on notion that the gaps in a net or mesh looked like
spots.
Another: This. and the alternative spellings “maile” and “maille”.
derive through the Italian maglia, from the Latin macula, meaning
“mesh of a net”.
What is the Scottish name for the breast feather of a hawk?
I also am a lifelong student of linguistics, history, art, and
culture. I, back in the day, loved playing Advanced Dungeons and
Dragons (AD&D). And, unfortunately, I have worked for years doing
computer and network programming in several languages. I have also
been an English as a Second Language (ESL) teacher, once upon a time
while in Asia. So, that said, I also really like the correct
terminology and agree with that.
So, I thought adding some facts together about armor made with chain
links might be interesting. The second part of this email is an
attempt at a brief summary/history of armor made with chain links.
First, in terms of which to use: chain ‘mail’ vs. ‘maille’. As will
hopefully be seen here from the history below, the term chain mail
is only really meant to refer to the ‘fabric’ made from chain links.
Thus, it is perhaps best to focus on the end product instead of the
fabric for the best correct term to use, as each piece has a
different name. Still a brief few thoughts about ‘mail’ and ‘maille’
might be useful.
Chain mail, at least presently, is ambiguous, but is also well
suited as the term for armor made of chain links. On the one hand,
chain mail brings to mind the forming of a chain by sending letters
to multiple people (a kind of ‘spam’ [Unsolicited Email]), at least
to many of those familiar with computer-based e-mail. To these
technical people chain mail (viz. chainmail) definitely is not armor.
On the other hand, to other folks, “Chainmail” is remembered as the
precursor to the game AD&D. Also, to yet others chain mail is a type
of armor that is selectable in the game AD&D or at The Society for
Creative Anacronism (SCA) events and games.
Maille, again currently speaking, is ambiguous due to the fact that
there are place names with the word used (e.g. Maill, Vienne). I
think that if I were to use the term ‘maille’ in a French
conversation that that I would be confusing, for the added reasons
Leonid mentioned. The spelling is possibly more sophisticated-looking
for the ‘average’ English speaker, however.
There are other terms for chain mail, too. I personally like the
Old-English term ‘mayle’, though most folks are probably not
familiar with this alternative spelling. But, the term ‘mayle’ is
interesting due to the fact that it is more clearly visible as a
corruption of the Italian ‘maglia’, (a net’s mesh) and the Latin
‘macula,’ similarly meaning “the mesh of a net”.
Terms in Southeast Asian languages (e.g. Hindi, Nepali, Maithili,
etc) are notably lacking for armor made from chain, though it has
been historically available there as well. In Hindi, for example,
‘body armor’ is simply known as shariirtraaN ??? [capital
letter added as transliteration for Devanagari’s retroflex symbol] or
kavacha ???. In all of the museums and armories that I visited there
were plentiful examples of chain mail, but they were not labeled as
chain mail. If there is a term specifically for chain mail, or their
garments, I have not seen it in Hindi or Nepali. I suspect that in
those places chain mail was available, again (see below), only to the
richest of the populace.
A Very Brief History and Summary of European “Chain Mail” Armor
…
“Chain mail”, also known as “chain-mail”, “chain mayle”, or “ring
mail” (Vikings), is a flexible form of armor that can be crafted to
fit the contour of most any body part. Chain mail can conform to the
body to allow it some subtle movement, in comparison with the rigid
plate-based armors. Chain armor technology even today continues to
have utility, especially by butchers and other occupations that
require constant use of bladed instruments, to avoid injury. Chain
armor is certainly one of the best for protecting against raw blades
and especially to protect the hands.
The word chain mail refers to the material the armor is made from
and not the garment that is subsequently fabricated from the
material. For example, a shirt made from mail is called a ‘hauberk’
(knee-length), a ‘haubergeon’ (mid-thigh length), or a ‘byrnie’ or
‘bernie’ (waist-length). A mail collar that hangs from a helmet is
called a ‘camail’ or ‘aventail’, and one made to be worn strapped
around the neck is called a ‘pixane’ or ‘standard’, while complete
mail hoods are referred to as ‘coif’. Mail gloves are called ‘mitons’
(mittens) and the coverings for the legs made are called ‘chausses’.
Chain mail is easily thought of in association with the knights of
the Medieval Age. However, chain-based armor is most likely a Celtic
invention, with examples that date even several hundred years before
Christ (B.C.). Chain mail also appears in Greek art of circa 300
B.C., and well as was used by both Roman warriors and later the
Vikings. The Carolingian (Charlemagne) Paladins then used chain mail
in 8th and 9th centuries A.D., and subsequently the knights of the
Middle Ages used chain mail as a part of their armor wardrobe.
The prevalence of the use of chain mail armor throughout history is
likely due to its being lightweight, comparatively speaking, and
versatile as a defense against slashing weapons. The main drawback
of the use of chain armor, of course, is that it can be pierced
through the links if struck by a sharp, or slender-enough, object, or
with enough force. Chain armor also cannot prevent bone breaks or
other internal injuries to the wearer. If struck hard enough by even
blunt weapons, such as a lance, mace or club in jousting or fighting,
there could still be serious injury without the armor being
penetrated. The natural solution for this is to use padding and
layers of leather worn beneath the mail to increase the wearer’s
protection.
Chain mail armor might not be the best protection in comparison to
other forms of armor (e.g. plate), but chain armor was a form of
protection available to warriors and fighters from very early
history, assuming that they could afford it. The production of mail
armor was very costly and labor intensive for a long time, and still
is very labor intensive to create by hand. In this way, however, most
mail armor garments were so expensive that they were available almost
exclusively to knights and warriors with enough wealth to obtain them
and a common soldier would rarely possess any such protection. The
further refinement and development of chain mail armor for body parts
was then seen by the Middle Ages.
By the early Middle Ages mail armor was available to cover any and
every body part, head to foot. In the 11th century A.D., the knight’s
‘mail shirt’ became longer and closer fitting, and terms began to
emerge for the various aforementioned body parts. Sleeves were
lengthened from the biceps to the wrists and the hem of the mail
shirt was dropped to below the knees. Then, by the 13th century thin
solid plates of iron or steel were added to enhance the mail armor.
Mail armor protection for horses also became common. Finally, by the
early 14th century plate armor had been added for the protection of
joints and extremities, but also incorporating mail as part of the
glue and ornamentation of the armor itself.
War strategists, however, had been hard art work to create
mechanisms and weapons that that could be used against this
long-standing impediment. Improved warfare technology brought such
weapons as the long bow, the crossbow, and other high speed
projectiles, against which chain mail protection was simply
inadequate.
Around 1440 the first full suit of plate armor was produced. Chain
mail was so flexible and adaptable, however, that even as plate armor
then became more used mail armor did not disappear completely. Chain
continued to be utilized to cover all the parts of the body that
simple plate pieces could not cover and as the connections between
the plate armor pieces themselves.
References Used:
…
Society for Creative Anachronism.
Mail (armour)
Chalmers, M., et al. Pocket Oxford Hachette French Dictionary.
Oxford Universtiy Press. 1996.
Ford, R. et al. Weapon: A Visual History of Arms and Armor. DK
Publishing. 2010.
McLeod, W. Collin’s Gem Latin Dictionary. William Collins Sons &
Co. Ltd. 1957.
Nielson, A., et al. Webster’s New International Dictionary, Second
Edition. G. & C. Mirriam Company. 1934.
Pathak, R. Bhargava’s Concise Dictionary of the Hindi Language.
Shree Ganga Pustakalaya. 1989.
