I've always found that toothpaste works remarkably well. Apply with a toothbrush of course, and warm water.
Would be abrasives in toothpaste not dull the polished surface, or
are the particles too small to have such an effect?
Helen
Thanks for a very informative reply Peter. Yes, I guess itās easy to
forget that there was life (and jewellery making) centuries if not
millenia before the ultrasonic cleaner. My ultrasonic has a heater
which gets the solution nice and hot. Perhaps if I put them in there
for a while without switching the ultrasonic function on, that may do
the trick?
Thanks again.
Helen
UK
Peter Rowe,
As usual, you respond in a solid, believable, logical manner. I know
many on Orchid, more than appreciate your input, I sure do. It is
persons like you, which make Orchid the valued treasure it is.
Unconditional pure and simple.
Iād like to throw out a suggestion. I know Orchid Archives are vast
pools of We encourage new members to join Orchid, and
at times when one asks a question, the reference to the Archives is a
bit less than polite. I wonder if it is the right time now, to
publish a book āTips from Orchidās Archives.ā Perhaps even a series
of topical books, such as the above subject, Ultrasonics.
Frequent other online discussions, such as Finishing, beg for some
clarity. When using products bearing different Brand Names across
the Globe, I frequently see confusion.
I know a panel with such stalwarts as Charles Lewton Brain, Peter
Rowe, could evaluate archived and select that material
best designated for publication, stuff that really works and would
do no harm to the person, the buyer, or the environment. I can think
of many others with valuable but I think because of an
affiliation, a possibility of an agenda may arise. There is a very
fine line to be walked.
One book I would love to own is clear definition of 3M products, and
their best use. I did buy a bunch at Tucson last year, but find
about correct application, is not easy to find, so have
not yet tried them. I am constantly into catalogs trying to compare
color and grit. So that is on my Wish List.
Hugs,
Terrie
Iāve always found that toothpaste works remarkably well. Apply with a
toothbrush of course, and warm water.
Toothpaste is a bad idea for cleaning jewelry. They can have
abrasives that scratch and damage metal and gems. Old toothbrush,
Palmolive dish soap or equivalent for minimalist jewelry cleaning.
Richard Hart
I've always found that toothpaste works remarkably well. Apply witha tooth brush of course, and warm water.
Iād really suggest you use the warm/boiling water, ammonia, and
dishsoap combinationā¦I used that for many years before I had an
ultrasonic, and still use that system for fragile or questionable
stones, esp. when they are not mine!!! Never had a problem, except
for learning the hard way that lemon or citrus based detergents are
not good for the finish on sterling.
But I have to disagree with the toothpaste ideaā¦many recent
experiences with customers who come into the store and wonder why
their jewelry is so dull have taught me to ask how they clean it.
Almost inevitably the answer is toothpaste on a brush!! Other than a
basic cheap baking soda toothpaste without any āwhiteningā
ingredients, toothpaste is too harsh for silver or gold. Teeth
recover from the silica gels (if your diet isnāt lousy), but jewelry
doesnāt. I charge the customer for a complete refinish, and suggest
they use a mild dishsoap on a clean toothbrush for future cleaning
(which is how we start any cleaning before repairs).
I have a friend who uses draino to clean jewelry, but havenāt tried
that myself yetā¦the soap/water/ammonia worked super for me for
many years and still is what I use for a standby when I question the
stoneās ability to survive the ultrasonic.
Tim
We have very seldom, if ever, damaged peridot in the ultrasonic. We
have etched the surface of peridots with boric acid after applying
boric acid and alcohol to the piece prior to soldering. They can be
very sensitive to acids.
I remember I did ruin a faceted amber, that I had just had specially
cut, by leaving it in the ultrasonic too long. It looked like a root
beer flavored jolly rancher that I had left out in the rain. I also
dissolved parts of a malachite inlay one time by forgetting it in
the ultrasonic. But you can only make the same mistakes so many
times, then you move on to new bigger and better mistakes.
Mark
My ultrasonic has a heater which gets the solution nice and hot. Perhaps if I put them in there for a while without switching the ultrasonic function on, that may do the trick?
That depends on what cleaning solution youāre using. Ultrasonics
themselves can be used with often very mild solutions. With a āboil
outā, youāll want something thatās an aggressive agent against
grease, oil, wax, etc, the binders in polishing compounds. Whether
you can use the ultrasonicās heater depends on how hot it gets. A
boil out pot works best when it really is almost boiling, since in an
ultrasonic, the scrubbing action can remove compound that still
solid, while the boil out works best when it can actually melt and
dissolve the compounds binders. The heat is necessary to work well.
Iād suggest an actual saucepan, on a hot plate or the stove or
something. cheap and easy. Depending on whatās in the pot (cleaning
agents), you may need ventillation.
Peter
As usual, you respond in a solid, believable, logical manner. I know many on Orchid, more than appreciate your input, I sure do. It is persons like you, which make Orchid the valued treasure it is. Unconditional pure and simple.
Well, um, gosh. Thanks.
I'd like to throw out a suggestion. I know Orchid Archives are vast pools of We encourage new members to join Orchid, and at times when one asks a question, the reference to the Archives is a bit less than polite. I wonder if it is the right time now, to publish a book "Tips from Orchid's Archives." Perhaps even a series of topical books, such as the above subject, Ultrasonics.
Not a new idea. Once again, Hanuman and Charles are already in the
forefrontā¦ The idea, started a number of years ago, is the āOrchid
in printā planned book series. The first one is the excellent review
of getting the most from your flex shaft, which you can now buy. I
was actually asked by Hanuman if Iād be interested in writing
another in the series, one on torches and torch use. Ever unaware of
my own significant limitations, and flattered by the request, I
agreed. That was something like three or four years ago (Hanuman?) I
rather quickly, to my dismay, found that while Iām good enough and
quickly dashing off an off the cuff answer to something from the
depths of my memories, when one peeks out, itās a whole other matter
to sit down and actually plan and write something thats intended as
complete, exhaustive, fully correct and fact checked, etc. Can you
say āwriterās blockā? Add in the ever increasing degree to which age
and almost 40 years of diabetes seem to be taking a toll on my energy
levels and productivity in those limited evening hours Iāve got
available, and it seems I just donāt seem able to get very far. Iād
manage to get a bunch of stuff written, and then when I got back to
it, Iād find I not only didnāt like what Iād written, but it often
was no longer quite right. I have a few jewelry commissions that
have equally managed to get me bogged down for amazingly long periods
of time. [sigh] Even knowing the subject, Iāve found myself totally
stymied by the project. Very humbling indeed, and so far, only barely
started. Seems as fast as I get started on some aspect of it, I find
the facts and details (like available brands of torchesā¦) have once
again changed, for example. Iāve sort of let Hanuman know I was in
trouble on this, and hope Iām not in too much trouble with him tooā¦
Last I heard, Charles was working on yet another of his wonderful
writings, supposedly to take a place in the planned series. I have no
other info on where the project stands at this point. I do hope
Hanuman isnāt still holding his breath for this thing from meā¦ I
frankly donāt think I can do it.
I know a panel with such stalwarts as Charles Lewton Brain, Peter Rowe, could evaluate archived and select that material best designated for publication, stuff that really works and would do no harm to the person, the buyer, or the environment. I can think of many others with valuable but I think because of an affiliation, a possibility of an agenda may arise. There is a very fine line to be walked.
Agreed, sort of. I see no real problem with having people in the
closest contact with various types of tools or product to have an
active hand in such publications, especially if there are more than
one such company/affiliation involved. Such writers have more in
depth knowledge of the products than others. So long as such a
publication made every effort to remain impartial and fair to the
writers competitors too, or better, collaborated with them, then Iād
have no problem with thatā¦ Everyone has some agenda or other. So
long as itās disclosed and in the open, and everyone is being fair
with one another, I donāt see that as a problem. Common sense can
resolve most such disputes easily enough.
One book I would love to own is clear definition of 3M products, and their best use. I did buy a bunch at Tucson last year, but find about correct application, is not easy to find, so have not yet tried them. I am constantly into catalogs trying to compare color and grit. So that is on my Wish List.
Some of that would be hard to write. Some products disappear faster
than you can get a book in print, and others would appear during the
production, so it could hardly ever be actually up to date by
publication time. And some of the āintended applications and usesā
end up being not so hot in real life, while other products may find
uses in the hands of some craftspeople that are not at all what 3M
intended, or donāt work for everyone else. I would agree with you,
though, that it would be nice to be able to better compare products
from one vendor to another. Especially vexing in this regard is when
vendors take a product thatās readily available from others, and
give it their own company brand or trade name, thus making it
impossible, from the catalog, to tell whether itās the same product
or not. Without intending insult, I find Rio Grande to be the biggest
offender in this regard. No doubt it keeps those who first find a
product in their catalog, coming back to them and not the other
vendors, but it also keeps others, like me, who may have found
products elsewhere, from figuring out whether Rio has a better price
on the thing or not, so while it gets them some sales, it costs them
others. I personally wish all the vendors would be fully open about
the source and producers of their products. Vendors, give us the
manufacturers name, please, so we know what weāre actually buying. If
you give us good enough service, weāll be back, no matter what minor
price fluctuations exist. Then, if youāre having a product actually
custom made for you, tell us itās an exclusive, and why. In that
environment of open Iāll be much more likely to believe
a claim of exclusivity, or a product really only available from
youā¦ Donāt hide your products behind fancy brand names only you
use, for products others carry as wellā¦
Peter Rowe
Crest makes a great toothbrush (Spin Brush Pro) which can be used to
remove polishing compound from jewelry.
The head of the brush consists of two sections, one rotates and the
other section reciprocates.
It is power by AA batteries. You can buy replacement heads.
It costs around $6.00. The bristles can be either soft or hard. You
might want to try it.
Using a brush with soap to clean tripoli from a piece of jewelry may
cause scratches on the piece. Tripoli contains abrasive particles.
The action of the soap and brush moves the abrasive tripoli into the
soap foam. The foam of the soap retains the grit until it is rinsed
off the piece. The motion of the brush can drag the abrasive grit
filled soap against the surface of the piece.
If this is a problem you might want to consider cleaning the piece
after the tripoli step then polish it with water soluble rouge then
wash it again.
I find liquid Dial soap and warn water works well for cleaning
tripoli and Rouge from my jewelry.
Lee Epperson
Iām just going to throw this out there on this topic. While with
customerās stones I ALWAYS err on the side of caution, I have to say
that when they were stones that belonged to me, I have put every
single one mentioned in all of these posts into both the ultrasonic
and steam cleaner and nothing has ever happened to any of them. This
includes opals (thousands), tanzanite (some), emerald (maybe
thousands) and a host of other rare, bizarre and fragile material.
Never have I had one come out in a different condition than it was
when it went in. Would I leave an opal/emerald/tanzanite in the
ultrasonic for hours? No, but to run them for a minute or two to get
some of the heavier gunk off has never been a problem. This doesnāt
mean it canāt happen, just that in my experience, the odds are
actually on your side, not the ultrasonicās. But would I do this with
the customerās $50,000 emerald? Not on your life. Toothbrush and
ivory liquid (not toothpaste which is often abrasive) is about it
then.
Daniel R. Spirer, G.G.
Daniel R. Spirer Jewelers, LLC
1780 Massachusetts Ave.
Cambridge, MA 02140
Hi, On the subject of cleaning after stones were set. If ultra sonic
is too dangerous try this. I worked in a shop with 18 jewelers from
Russia, Germany, Italy, Poland. We used a solution of hot water, from
the tap, dish soap, and a splash of amonia. approx. 1/3 cup water,
tea. of soap and amonia. and a soft tooth brush. to get in under
settings. if needed. Never put in Pearls or Opals. or as you now have
found Peridot, generally anything with porosity or easily cleavable
stones we always steered away from Ultrasonic cleaning. could harm
these for good. That was our experience. Just adding my 2cents.
Barb. K
Hi Tim,
Thanks for your reply. This is the same solution I use in my
ultrasonic so using just the heater function without the ultrasonic
would work. Is this okay for things like pearls or not?
Helen
UK
That depends on what cleaning solution youāre using.
I add dishsoap and ammonium hydroxide (what you call ammonia but is
actually ammonia gas dissolved in water, giving ammonium hydroxide)
to water. I donāt see the point in buying expensive specially
prepared ultrasonic solutions that are basically just the same so mix
it myself. I guess youāre probably right that it needs to be boiling
or nearly boiling to dissolve the binders properly. Iāll try what you
suggest. Iām sure I can sacrifice an old pan for the purpose.
Thanks again Peter.
Helen
UK
Hi Mark,
Thatās useful to know, that peridots are sensitive to acids.
My worst stone disasters have been caused by sheer stupidity on my
part. I know full well that if you heat a stone and then quench it in
cold water you are exposing it to thermal shock and that it WILL
shatter. But when annealing and soldering numerous times everyday, it
has now become a reflex action to quench in water afterwards, and
when Iāve occasionally had to solder something with stones still in
place (diamonds, sapphires, rubies or CZās), although Iāve
repeatedly told myself ādonāt quench, donāt quenchā I have sometimes
done exactly that, and heard that horrible sound of the stone
shattering. I think Iāve done it on about three occasions and in each
case it was always a favourite stone I only had one of!!!
Thanks for the tips.
Helen
UK
I havenāt heard anyone mention Ionic cleaners, which clean by
electrolysis. The cleaning solution is not hot, and therefore is
safe for even heat sensitive stones.
Mine is a Speedbrite. I use it for emerald and opal jewelry, mainly.
I put them in there for a few minutes, which loosens up and
dissolves most polishing compounds. I may use a toothbrush if they
are still a little dirty. Then I rinse and blow them dry with a can
of compressed air to avoid waterspots, if I canāt steam them.
Ionics will also remove tarnish and antiquing from silver. Iāve
revived quite a few awfully tarnished chains, charms, and other
intricate pieces by using the Ionic, and then steaming off a layer of
tarnish, and repeating that until itās bright white. Just make sure
to change the cleaning solution often - it needs to be clean to work.
Lauren
Hi Lee,
Thanks for your reply.
Using a brush with soap to clean tripoli from a piece of jewelry may cause scratches on the piece. Tripoli contains abrasive particles. The action of the soap and brush moves the abrasive tripoli into the soap foam. The foam of the soap retains the grit until it is rinsed off the piece. The motion of the brush can drag the abrasive grit filled soap against the surface of the piece.
Thatās why I donāt use a brush and prefer the hot, soapy ammoniated
water approach. Before I bought my ultrasonic, I was using the
toothbrush, soap and hot water method and was as you point out, just
causing more scratches. So now Iām much happier cleaning using the
ultrasonic with soapy ammonia water between each polish stage so
that I donāt introduce more scratches than Iāve just polished off. I
will try the pan with the ammonia and soap solution though for stones
which donāt like the ultrasonic action.
Thanks again.
Helen
UK
Hi Daniel,
stones that belonged to me, I have put every single one mentioned in all of these posts into both the ultrasonic and steam cleaner and nothing has ever happened to any of them.
Thanks for the info. It would be a case of Murphyās law (or whoever
you prefer) that nothing untoward happened with thousands of your
own stones and then if one were to try it on a customerās stone, it
would spoil! I guess care and common sense should prevail with this
just as in anything.
Thanks again.
Helen
UK
Hi Lauren,
I was wondering about Ionic cleaners. Iāve only heard of them since
I joined Orchid. Do you use just your Ionic cleaner or an ultrasonic
too?
Helen
UK
I remember years ago we had a job from a particularly particular
jeweler. I had to fabricate some settings and set a couple of
diamonds and a large and very fine looking ruby. The instructions on
the envelope said, among other things, āNo Steam, No Sonic, No
Nothing!ā
I went ahead and did the job and set the stones. In this case I
couldnāt āpresetā the ruby (thatās where you set it, then remove it,
polish and clean everything and then reset it as the very last step
before delivery).
I polished the ring and (always having trouble following rules) I
had to swish it in the ultrasonic to loosen some of the polishing
compound. I hardly even got it wet! When I delivered it the jeweler
she actually freaked out.
It turned out that the ruby had been oiled and I had pulled the oil
out when cleaning in the sonic. She refused to pay me for the entire
months work as punishment (dozens of jobs that were unrelated to the
one I had screwed up). I dropped the account, I paid her for the
ruby and returned it to the stone dealer in Chicago, who reimbursed
me for half of its value. The jewelers husband came over weeks later
and settled up the balance they owed me (unknown to his wife).
The lesson I learned there, besides the obvious never swish treated
rubies, was that itās just jewelry for goodness sake. When things
like that happen itās better to try to look at the bigger picture,
resolve the problem and move on.
The lesson I learned there, besides the obvious never swish treated rubies, was that it's just jewelry for goodness sake
The lesson I would have taken out of it would have been to follow
the instructions.
Daniel R. Spirer, G.G.
Daniel R. Spirer Jewelers, LLC
1780 Massachusetts Ave.
Cambridge, MA 02140