There is no need to through it away. Simply pickle or wipe down, it is not really a worry unless you have great piles of crud on the solder. Cleanliness in the solder joint area and of the solder is important but it is not going to keep the solder from melting and flowing in a well fluxed joint.
Ditto… although James is the expert and I’m a widdle bitty nobody,
Judy in Kansas
Yeah, what Binnion said about soldering ; spot on. I don’t recallever
cleaning solder unless it had mud or food or something extreme on it.
Seems to me whatever oxidation takes place in air at room temperature
over time isn’t going to be more than what happens as solder heats up
with a flame if it’s exposed to air. Regardless, I’ve never
experienced oxidized solder being any kind of problem. The basics Jim
explained about heating and fluxing are by far more important than
having oxide-free solder, in my opinion. Once the flux is liquid
(like paste flux as it gets to the right temperature) it will work
on dissolving surface oxidation, and once the solder melts on metal
that’s hot enough to facilitate solder flow, old surface oxidation
doesn’t really have the same old surface to be on and becomes
assimilated into the melt. That’s what I see.
DS
WELLLLLLLLLLLL> reference the “clean” solder! I didn’t mention that
cleanliness of the metal is also vital…sure did open a can of
worms! The nice part of this group, we are all friends after heated
agreements or disagreements. I clean the metal thoroughly, but will
stand by the clean solder, and proper fluxing and heat!
Rose Marie Christison
sure did open a can of worms! The nice part of this group, we are all friends after heated agreements or disagreements
I thought I’d read all the posts on this topic, but it seems I missed
something. I don’t recall any cans of worms being opened, or any
disagreements, and certainly no heated disagreements. Just different
people’s experiences.
Helen
UK
WELLLLLLLLLLLL> reference the "clean" solder! I didn't mention that cleanliness of the metal is also vital....sure did open a can of worms! The nice part of this group, we are all friends after heated agreements or disagreements. I clean the metal thoroughly, but will stand by the clean solder, and proper fluxing and heat!
Absolutely right, clean is good, both metal and solder. Just trying
to say that tarnished “dirty” solder will not cause it to ball up
and not flow. That is more likely from cold metal or not enough flux
or burned out flux
James Binnion
James Binnion Metal Arts
I have read all of the comments and have a slew of questions. Are
you readyto respond to some of your responses?
QUESTIONS ABOUT SOLDERING
Does any of thisadvice apply to the base metals as well?
How long does solder stayfresh? How can you keep it fresh as long
as possible? How can you tell it isnot fresh?
For jump rings, don’t you have to heat the entire chain?
How do you soldera chain without using tweezers?
(understanding that tweezers can become a heat sink)
How can you see solder snippets if they are in the flux?
Is abutane/plumber’s torch hot enough to anneal nickel, brass and
copper?
How do you warm upthe flux beforesoldering?
How do you makeyour own flux?
How do you use flux correctly? Incorrectly use?
Instead of using sheet solder and cutting snippets, my teacher
taught us to run the wire through the press slightly, have any of you
done this?
How is weldingf lux different?
Must you use distilled water to reconstitute paste flux?
How much flux is enough? How much is too much?
What is the difference between volume of heat vs temperature?
How can you prevent cooking off the solder as you use it?
May I recommend the text “Complete Metalsmith” by Tim McCreight?
Kindest Regards, R
How long does solder stay fresh? How can you keep it fresh as long as possible? How can you tell it is not fresh?
Paste solder may have a shelf life. But real solder doesn’t.
For jump rings, don't you have to heat the entire chain?
Why would you?
How do you solder a chain without using tweezers? (understanding that tweezers can become a heat sink)
Lay everything out carefully on a charcoal block.
How can you see solder snippets if they are in the flux?
Don’t use that gloppy paste flux. (Hey, let’s revisit the alcohol
and boric acid thread!)
Get a jar (I use a wide mouth apothecary jar) and fill it most of
the way up with denatured alcohol. Add to it as much boric acid (not
borax) powder as it will take up, and a little bit more. Shake it
and allow it to settle and never shake it again!
Dip, brush or somehow coat your gold or silver with this liquid and
allow it to flame. When the flames die there will be a nice thin
coating of boric acid powder on your piece. Solder.
(I use a hypodermic syringe with the point sanded safe filled with
commercial green liquid flux for those jobs that require an extra
squirt of flux (usually silver).
Is abutane/plumber's torch hot enough to anneal nickel, brass and copper?
Depends on the thickness, size, weight of the metal.
How do you warm up the flux before soldering?.
never
Instead of using sheet solder and cutting snippets, my teacher taught us to run the wire through the press slightly, have any of you done this?
I use snippets of the original metals when working with fine gold
and silver.
How can you prevent cooking off the solder as you use it?
What does that mean?
The dirty solder thing is interesting. Mine is often tarnished or
oxidised, and doesn’t receive the same care and attention as the
items I’m actually soldering. Sometimes, I actually anneal solder
panels before cutting, because it makes them less brittle, and they
still work. There seem to be so many myths which are taken as a
given in this trade - how do they come about? I wonder if the dirty
solder thing has come about because of the extra consideration that
people put into their work as they become more dedicated to it; so
it’s the dedication, not the cleaning of the solder, that makes the
difference. But they don’t realise that - it’s always easier to
assume it’s down to your tools, not you.
Jamie Hall
http://primitive.ganoksin.com
Don't use that gloppy paste flux. (Hey, let's revisit the alcohol and boric acid thread!)
I do use gloppy paste flux, I do thin it with water. Flux your piece
and then heat till the flux is white, put your solder snippets where
you need it, gently heat with a pick in one hand and if a something
moves, move it back where you need it. The solder does not jump
around, it can slide.
I had never heard of Luxi-flux until recently. I know someone who
uses it, it is boric acid and alcohol and apparently something else
which makes it work better than any other flux according to a bench
jeweler friend of mine. I know Romanoff has it. It only comes in
gallon size, and there is a hazmat fee. Indian Jewelers supply has
it in quarts and gallons, but they won’t ship.
Anyone else use Luxi-flux?
Richard Hart G.G.
Denver, Co.
For jump rings, don't you have to heat the entire chain?
Certainly not! If you did that, you’d likely end up melting the
solder in every link, and you’d probably end up with a solid
chain!!! Heating the whole piece when using silver, would translate
to heating the whole jump ring to be soldered rather than just the
joint in the jump ring, but in the case of jump rings for chain,
chances are that due to the size of the ring compared to the flame,
you can’t help but heat the entire jump ring anyway.
How do you solder a chain without using tweezers? (understanding that tweezers can become a heat sink)
I actually do solder chain using tweezers as a heat sink. I find
that it enables me to make very fine chain (for handmade chain that
is, and don’t ask how fine, as I have no idea; I just mean fine for
me, which of course would be chunky for manufactured chain). It’s
easier when making chain, to solder half of the links closed first,
then join them using the open links, soldering them closed by
holding the two already joined, adjacent links in the tweezers. I
hold them in such a way, that the link to be soldered, can still be
moved back and forth. That way, the “loose”, unsoldered link can be
heated up to solder melting temperature, without the adjacent links
(which are being held by the tweezers) heating up to anything near
that temperature, i.e. you can heat the single, “loose” link to red
heat, without the links in the tweezers changing colour at all. The
use of tweezers helps to avoid melting the links together. That
technique works of course, for a simple cable chain, but probably
not for a more complex chain; but complex chains often have
unsoldered links anyway. They often don’t need to be soldered, as
the complex design of linking with multiple links (as in say a rope
chain) allows the chain to have plenty enough strength even without
soldering. Loop in loop chains are great, as you solder or fuse
(depending on the metal used) all links closed and then “weave” the
links together, after bending them into “U” shapes.
Instead of using sheet solder and cutting snippets, my teacher taught us to run the wire through the press slightly, have any of you done this?
I have used wire solder occasionally, and ran it through my rolling
mill to flatten it. Alternatively you could use a hammer and hammer
it flat, then cut into snippets. I used that method when using some
solder wire that arrived far too thick to cut into small enough
pieces. Some solder wires (eg, gold) come as very thin wires, so
they’re easy to cut into tiny snippets anyway. But I do prefer using
sheet solder, first cutting a “fringe” into the sheet, then cutting
across that fringe to make tiny snippets.
How can you prevent cooking off the solder as you use it?
Do you mean the solder or the flux? The solder won’t “cook off”, but
some lower-melting temperature metals in the solder alloy, (the ones
that lower the temperature of the alloy itself, and thus make it a
solder rather than just an “ordinary” alloy) CAN evaporate, and thus
change the solder’s composition, which I suppose could render it
useless, or perhaps make the joint brittle and pitted. I would
imagine that you’d have to severely overheat it for quite a time to
cause the solder not to flow at all, due to losing lower melting
temperature metals from the solder alloy.
If you heat too hot and for too long, you can “cook off” your flux
though. Then you’d get into trouble with the metal oxidising and the
solder not flowing anyway, if it hasn’t already flowed. The key is
to get in and solder as hot and as quickly as possible, rather than
with a cooler flame for a longer time, as getting up to solder
temperature slowly is how you run into problems with evaporating
your flux and/or metals in the solder alloy.
I hope that makes sense; I do tend to waffle on, in the hope of
being understood. Other folks probably explain things better, or
have a better knowledge of it than I do.
Helen
UK
Re: Luxi-flux
You know me, Richard, I try anything new, like 6 or so years ago!
Have a quart of the stuff, but don’t like it! If you would like it, I
will bring it by for you. I like Batterns - the paste is fine if it
is diluted a bit, as you state.
Rose Marie Christison
I do use gloppy paste flux, I do thin it with water.
I learned using that paste type. I also was taught to place solder
then heat. And I know solder slides (sometimes it jumps). But anyway,
I no longer do that…(except in rare circumstances when there is no
other choice). I prefer to ball my snippets, pick them up with a
soldering stick, and place them exactly where I need them to be and
the exact time the metal is hot enough to “take” the solder.
Anyone else use Luxi-flux?
The difference between Luxi-Flux and alcohol & boric acid is blue
dye. Oh and I guess they use reagent grades of both chemicals. I used
to use Luxi-Flux but it’s too expensive with all the unnecessary US
government shipping taxes.
The difference between Luxi-Flux and alcohol & boric acid is blue dye. Oh and I guess they use reagent grades of both chemicals. I used to use Luxi-Flux but it's too expensive with all the unnecessary US government shipping taxes.
Not unless you are using methanol. LuxiFlux is methanol based this
means it has a lot more boric acid in solution than you will get from
hardware store denatured alcohol (ethanol). So LuxiFlux puts more
boric acid into the joint area.
James Binnion
James Binnion Metal Arts
Not unless you are using methanol. LuxiFlux is methanol based this means it has a lot more boric acid in solution than you will get from hardware store denatured alcohol (ethanol). So LuxiFlux puts more boric acid into the joint area.
I stand corrected James Binnion (except about the unnecessary US
government shipping taxes to “protect” us.)
Thanx for the tip.