Andrew
As for me... My tags always say: ".999 Fine Silver. Please Handle With Care."
Making stuff out of 999 fine is just plain dumb without a really
good reason. PMC or enameling are a couple
jeffD
Demand Designs
Analog/Digital Modelling & Goldsmithing
http://www.gmavt.net/~jdemand
I used to think of repair work as uncreative and possibly a bit dull, but after the first few repairs and wowing the customers, who never imagined that their broken piece could be made to be like new and sometimes better than new, I now find that I really enjoy repair work. The customer satisfaction is worth it for me, just as much as making them a brand new piece.
Quite right, the smile is really worth all the boring simple sizings.
You also do learn more than imagined possible. Your own work is
linear and ought to be predictable or you are not thinking first.
Repairs are often a twisty path, even with lots of practice there
will be surprises. I still do like the smiles.
jeffD
Demand Designs
Analog/Digital Modelling & Goldsmithing
http://www.gmavt.net/~jdemand
Making stuff out of 999 fine is just plain dumb without a really good reason. PMC or enameling are a couple
I had a client wanting a fine silver dagger, apparently so he could
say he was hunting werewolves. I told him the price, and he settled
on a piece of 5160 
Regards Charles A.
Repairs are often a twisty path, even with lots of practice there will be surprises. I still do like the smiles.
The comment I hear most often when I show the customer the repair is
“It’s perfect” and as a man, it is an acknowledgment I never get
tired of hearing.
and I make the customer aware that as a man I appreciate hearing
that from a woman. They always laugh…
Richard Hart G.G.
Denver, Co.
The whole ‘QVC’ issue is a red herring - people buying from those
sites/channels are fulfilling a different urge to the people who
come into your shop to buy something nice - it might even be the
same customer.
We have good diamond-buying customers that occassionally come in and
tell us that their “cousin”, “neighbour” or “best friend” has bought
this ring from QVC, and can we size it for them. It’s never them
that bought it, in the same was that it’s always your friend that’s
considering whether they need to go to the STD clinic, and not you 
Regarding books on jewellery craft, that’s a really interesting
difference between modern textbooks and pre-WWII textbooks.
Nowadays, these books are full of photos of frankly butt-ugly “art”
jewellery from the long-term inmates of jewellery colleges, that
shows the process or technique being described, but don’t connect
that process to any concepts of design or proportion.
Older books, on the other hand, cover subjects like geometry and
drawing skills in addition to practical advice for the bench.
This rant was brought to you by a whipper-snapper below the age of
30. It is not a nostalgia rant.
Jeff,
I guess my reason for using fine silver is that its fun to play with
and hence to learn from.
It is a simplified way to learn the physical properties of silver
without having to deal with significant firescale or polishing
problems.
I am learning to pound out pieces of Sunshine Mine tokens into
rectangular wires, thin bezels, and small sheet, using my butane pen
torch for annealing.
I’m using my propane bottle for fusing the pieces I have hammered
out, most recently into a frame for a pendant.
Once forged the fine silver is about as hard as aluminum. I think it
has a use for low-wear applications, such as cocktail hour
adornments.
So what I’m doing is not really dumb. Fine silver has a use as a
construction material just like everything else, in its place.
Andrew Jonathan Fine
Nowadays, these books are full of photos of frankly butt-ugly "art" jewellery from the long-term inmates of jewellery colleges, that shows the process or technique being described, but don't connect that process to any concepts of design or proportion.
Hmm. just a thought here. Perhaps you need to try and broaden your
horizens as to your ideas of what beauty and design is. While there
may be a lot of student work in the colleges that leaves much to yet
be learned, it’s probably fair to say that what usually makes it into
the books, is made by people who’ve been pretty well trained, not
just in technique. In fact, the more common criticism of the art
school grads is that they’re training is MORE in the direction of
design and innovation and creativity, at the expense of classic
technique
Older books, on the other hand, cover subjects like geometry and drawing skills in addition to practical advice for the bench.
Perhaps, but many of these also spend lots of time showing you how
to make yet another of the time honored traditional designs, with no
thought to suggesting that you might try to innovate and come up with
your own designs. Kind of a “here’s how it’s done. Learn to do it
this way. Don’t do too much thinking on your own” sort of approach.
Yes, I know I’m being a bit extreme and unfair in this
characterization, as the books usually are not that bad. but that’s
sometimes more the general direction they take, much like the old
guild apprentiship training programs sometimes were…
This rant was brought to you by a whipper-snapper below the age of 30. It is not a nostalgia rant.
I’m gonna hazard a wild guess that just perhaps your jewelry
education did not come from one of those art schools. A large number
of the very long time denizens of the academic art world are highly
trained, accutely attuned to aesthetics as well as the long history
of the jewelry arts. The fact that some of the less aesthetically
enlightened/attuned/ trained in society have trouble understanding
the nature of just what they’re making and why, so they simply give
up and call it “butt ugly” is usually a frustration that simply has
to be, to some degree, accepted. It is, however, also true that some
of these people are so entrenched in their ivory towers that they’ve
somewhat lost either the sensativity to, or ability to communicate
with, the wider general public (their real audience, one would hope),
and when this happens, that’s an unfortunate divide that does not
serve them well. But I know many, (if not most of such people I know)
who are quite well attunded to both the art world and the general
puclic, and choose to still try and bring new ideas out. That’s why
it’s called “art”, rather than just “craft” or “tradework”. Like the
horse to water, you can show people new ideas, but you can’t make
them like or understand them if they don’t wish to. Sometimes the new
ideas are too new, and in need of additional development and thought
and evolution. Other times, it’s simply that people don’t want new
ideas. They’re happier with the tried and true traditional designs,
and don’t want their boat rocked…
Peter
wow amazing that my few words of frustration about one day at work
has spawned all this amazing conversation. i have learned allot and
adjusted my attitude a bit. i have also noticed allot of discussion
about using pure metals in jewellery and thought it time to put in
my 2 cents.
i use fine gold and fine silver as well as pure platinum and
palladium in jewellery. it is a common misunderstanding that these
metals are to soft to make anything that will stand up to a bit of
force. the issue is in the word malleability. a metal that has great
malleability can be worked longer without becoming brittle and
breaking this is true. but you can work these metals to a point of
work hardness that will be structurally strong and hard without them
cracking and breaking. when this level is reached they still retain
the ability to resist abrasion and will have a tendency to suffer a
scratch that is a burnish rather than a scratch that is material
loss.
fine silver is a wonderful metal to use as earring hooks as you can
make it very stiff but to get a 0.9mm earring wire that will stand
up to the test you need to pull that wire down from above 2 mm
without annealing it. and you can not us it as a post that you will
solder on after. but just about anyone can were it with out it
tarnishing and turning the skin black.
fine gold is just the same. if you want a size 9 ring you need to
cast (not solder) a size 4 with a wall thickness of 3 to 4 mm and
smith it up to size to get the hardness you need for structure.
the alternative to both of these is to tumble for 2 weeks.
in both of these applications you end up with products that will
never come back to your shop for repair under normal to heavy use.
fine gold and silver are also my metal of choice when using it for
inlay into engravings that i have done in knives guns titanium rings
and even engravings that have been completed in lower karat golds.
these are just a few of the things i use pure materials for.
every material has its application. it has been my experience that
the more pure the material the longer it will last. the down side is
you need to spend more time smithing it.
Les
Andrew,
Maybe ‘dumb’ was too strong a word, I do tend to be blunt at times
Fine silver is great for making 925, mix with copper or 900 coin
but not by itself. Play with the real stuff or one of the more fancy
alloys.
But why learn to work an alloy (actually non alloy) which has very
limited uses in jewellery. Sure 999 has no fire scale problems, I
wouldn’t agree that it is easier to polish, rather the opposite.
I just plain don’t like the stuff except for making other alloys. I
do have a couple of pounds of it on hand, but not for jewellery work
nor even practice, just alloy material.
jeffD
Demand Designs
Analog/Digital Modelling & Goldsmithing
http://www.gmavt.net/~jdemand
Les,
I salute you, sir!
You write from personal experience about your work with precious
metals in both their pure as well as alloyed forms. I believe that
you embody the true “alchemist’s spirit” which defines a real working
metalsmith!
Pardon me if I sing your praises too loudly, but the truth in what
you say cannot be understated here.
If you experiment with the pallet of precious metals available to
us, there is so much one can do with them! Many would speak of the
limitations of certain soft metals, but you have proved, by your own
hands, that the right techniques and structural considerations can
give these metals the properties needed for daily wear and the
accompanying abuse they must endure.
I look forward to reading your future posts here on Orchid.
Jay Whaley
Les,
It seems you are someone I should be learning from. I would be
interested in learning any and all special techniques for working
fine silver.
Andrew Jonathan Fine
Hmm. just a thought here. Perhaps you need to try and broaden your horizens as to your ideas of what beauty and design is. While there may be a lot of student work in the colleges that leaves much to yet be learned, it's probably fair to say that what usually makes it into the books, is made by people who've been pretty well trained, not just in technique. In fact, the more common criticism of the art school grads is that they're training is MORE in the direction of design and innovation and creativity, at the expense of classic technique.
I probably do need to broaden my horizons as to my ideas of what
beauty and design is. We can only be thankful that my comments are a
little tongue-in-cheek. The issue here is whether day-to-day bench
jewellery for public purchase is profession which contains a sub-set
of art jewellery, or whether art jewellery is a profession which
contains a sub-set of bench jewellery. In my humble and uneducated
opinion, art jewellery is a necessary aspect of the trade, one that
helps to drive design and aspiration both within the industry and
for the general public.
Despite the importance of art jewellery, it exists because of
bench jewellery, not instead of it, and as a consequence it isn’t
really helpful to have jewellers handbooks written by academics, and
decorated with pictures of their work - said work, rather than
pushing the boundaries of perceptions, serving mainly to date the
book to era of it’s publication.
Admittedly, I wasn’t very specific about the books that I’m talking
about, but texts by H. Maryon and G. E. Gee are examples that I have
hardcopies of, and they don’t give any instruction as to the
appearance of the work, just the technicalities of making it.
My current residency at Loughborough University is very enjoyable,
but also very niche. I’d be baffled if my work was used to
illustrate a book on contemporary bench jewellery. I suspect that
the choice of photographs has more to do with publishing houses
targeting students and dedicated hobbiests, rather than the working
jeweller - a creature who is, lets face it, small minded, poorly
educated and unwilling to innovate.
Always a pleasure talking to you, Peter
Jamie Hall
http://primitive.ganoksin.com
It seems you are someone I should be learning from. I would be interested in learning any and all special techniques for working fine silver.
andrew i am happy to give you all the you need ive just
sent you an email to your personal hotmail address i am happy to
answer any questions you might have
les
Jamie i am a working metal smith
i repair restore create and design. i can understand how some people
might see the working smith as small minded and unwilling to innovate
as we tend to sway to the practical application of what it is we do.
however art jewellery is just that “art” the most common
misconception is that it is a creative process. letting yourself go
and in effect allowing the ideas flow out of your fingers is a good
way to come up with a lovely aesthetic but it is not really creative
it is subconscious undirected and more times than not you end up
with tiny sculpture rather than practical jewellery. i use the term
practical as in its application not its form. is it comfortable??
will your customer were it every day?? will it stand up to regular
were and tear?? are stones set properly?? have you designed it in a
way that you can clean and finish it to a high standard?? is it
pleasing to the eye??
Artists are always saying to me “think out side the box” my response
is "you cant think outside of the box unless you first sit in one"
true creativity, in my opinion, is when you are given real tangible
restrictions to be creative in. this comes in on many levels. first
you are given colours you must work with. then you are given material
restrictions. then you are given a poorly drawn design that is at
best a concept. then you are given a size. lastly you are given a
budget you must not go over. Now the task is to make something that
is aesthetically pleasing to your customer as well as yourself so
you are proud to hand it over. You might now think you job is over
but it is not. working within all of these restrictions you must now
show you customer the bit of jewellery, that no longer looks anything
like the concept, and convince them it is exactly what they asked for
so that they ware it every day and send you more custom.
To me being creative and innovative is taking direction from someone
that knows nothing about the trade and making something beautiful
that is loved and worn. art jewellery will be beautiful but most of
the time is not to be worn. it is admired in a publication not by the
general public. it has its place to inspire and adore but very
rarely is used to adorn.
so with respect please don’t be to hard on those of us that hold
fast to hard earned skills in engineering and chemistry because allot
more thought is put into what we do than you might give us credit
for. when i put on my craftsman hat i am open to new things and
ideas. it is essential to my trade. when i am in my artist state i am
only ever interested in exercising my own self indulgence. other
artists might be offended by this, those of you who are it is time to
be honest with yourself.
Les Riddell
Artists are always saying to me "think out side the box" my response is "you cant think outside of the box unless you first sit in one" true creativity, in my opinion, is when you are given real tangible restrictions to be creative in.
Hats off to mr Riddell!
The art of design, as well as any discipline involving designing and
“creating”, is the Art of Limiting. There is nothing we can create,
that already has not been created by Nature. The best we can hope for
is to successfully copy from it. At the beginning of design process
our choices are unlimited, because Universe is unlimited. But as we
proceed to congeal the idea, we are rejecting things which either
could not, or should not be used. So the process of design is the
process of continuously shrinking the universe of choices, and
finally arriving at the subset, which fits our application.
It is appropriate to end with an example from History. Michelangelo
was asked once - How did he know to create his David? Michelangelo
response was that David was always there. All he did was to chip away
some extra marble.
Leonid Surpin
Les,
true creativity, in my opinion, is when you are given real tangible restrictions to be creative in.
That is certainly one avenue to creating-- and a useful one–but, in
my opinion, only one. Once again, I am surprised by the need to
ultimately categorize and deal in absolutes such as “true”.
Just my opinion as a working metalsmith.
Take care, Andy
Artists are always saying to me "think out side the box" my response is "you cant think outside of the box unless you first sit in one" true creativity, in my opinion, is when you are given real tangible restrictions to be creative in.
This thread has taken a tangent from the original… A couple
of thoughts of mine, in it’s current incarnation, though. There is
no “us” and “them”. There are two sorts of people in the world -
people who think there are two sorts of people in the world, and
people who don’t.
Like many here, we are professional jewelers who also get out into
the gallery scene and have wide-ranging interests. Jo-Ann was
president of the Metal Arts Guild here for ten years - we both used
to paste up (yes, old style) the newsletter every month. We worked
closely with Jim Binnion, and others here, to put together a couple
of large-scale shows for the membership, which was as arty as you
can get. Still is… Remember those days, Jim? He worked too
hard and too long on those, believe me.
I could rant a bit on some of what this thread is getting at, but I
won’t.
“I’m an ART jeweler!” is merely a way of being pretentious, stuff
like that. Think outside the box… (when I want your advise,
I’ll ask for it). There are a couple of things that DO matter,
though. Good jewelry (any craft) is a blend of design and
craftsmanship. I find that some who want to be “artists” are really
saying/thinking that they don’t have to bother with the skill part,
all they need is art. I also find that some don’t look at the old
masters or the new masters because that work doesn’t validate their
position - if Van Cleef is “real” jewelry, then my jewelry looks
pretty pathetic, eh? Therefore, it’s “merely” fine jewelry and I’m so
much better than that… Wrong, wrong, wrong and wrong. You
don’t have to like it, but you’d be well served by learning from it.
Much art jewelry is neither art nor artful, it’s just a label. Some
is both, much if not most is not. We go to the galleries, we see the
work.
There is no us and them, there’s only what you can do at the bench,
and what you can’t do, too.
A couple of weeks ago I made a basket setting pendant from scratch -
a hand ful of scrap 18kt. It was an 11ct. rhodolite pear with 24.06
cts. around it. Simple, common commodity piece, no doubt. Jo-Ann was
especially proud of it and went around showing it off, and people
were much impressed and there was much ooing and aahing and "My
gosh, that’s FABRICATED!!!??
That’s because there are ~two~ designs. The first is the what: A
pear basket with diamond surround. The second is the how: The
setting plate is just so, the wire prongs are just that size and
just that angle and just that way. The setting is trick, but also
secure, the bale is installed with sophistication, not just jump
rings, and the whole thing is finished to within an inch of it’s
life. In a word, craftsmanship makes it pop.
The mark of your ability isn’t that you know how to make some big
swooping brooch out of silver wire. Here’s a handful of silver shot
Oh, and BTW - I cleared around $3k on that conventional basket
setting, and it was bought before I made it, too. Nice work if you
can get it.