Seth, no, charge backs to the customer do not always happen if you have “return for exchange only-no refunds” on the credit card slip, and the receipt.
I understand your ethics.
Standing up for what is right, when someone is unreasonable, is not sending the wrong message to the team.
Allowing someone to manipulate you by a threat of legal action, there is also a realistic
reason to not allow yourself to be blackmailed.
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Ted - 100% of our work is one-off custom, that’s our specialty. We do get the occasional short-run – but for us a short-run is usually a customer who wants 2 or 3 of something. Once in a blue moon we get someone who wants 25 or more of something, but to be honest, that isn’t our sweet spot. We can do it of course, and do it well but there are many people who do that kind of work who are willing to do it for less money than we are.
Man, that’s a real bummer. Some people just want to stiff you, even for perfect work. A friend and I used to run a service business with a 100% satisfaction guarentee. Don’t pay if you’re not happy, and we’ll make sure to address any issues (within reason), but no refunds. It can be tough with some customers, especially with the ones who want to dodge you or try to chargeback.
Best of luck, and that finished piece is as close to the model as anyone could ever get! Some people will never understand stuff, even after multiple explanations…
Tim and I do all custom work. We very rarely have a return. I’d be willing
to say that 99.5% of our clients leave happy. We ran into trouble a few
times when we were working for a retail store and the sales folks did not
know how to communicate and sell custom properly.
We had a huge return this last year but it was our bad. We went a little
overboard on the first one. We love our client because she says “Well you
know what I like. Just go for it.” As a woman who owns and wears jewelry I
had a strong suspicion that the first was going to be something that could
only be worn once or twice a year for formal occasions. The client is a
good friend and a long time collector of our wok. We were happy to
accommodate her. Still it was hard to break down and melt the first piece.
Below see photos the first was too over the top for every day wear. The
second more modest piece she wears almost every day.
Have fun and make lots of jewelry.
Jo Haemer
www.timothywgreen.com
5 Likes
Absolutely beautiful work! It’s a shame you had to melt that first one down. It was quite exquisite!
A great piece. Must have hurt like hell to melt it. tom
HI Seth,
Yeah, you nailed the rendering. Whatever the issue may be, it wasn’t you.
That said, speaking as someone else who has to manage customer expectations and a business reputation, just refund it and move on. Every second you spend either arguing with him, managing fallout, or just being annoyed is a second that adds to the cost of the whole trainwreck. The cheapest way out is to cut your losses, get clear, and make more stuff for people other than him. I’ve made that call more than once, and never regretted it. Life’s too short.
Regards,
Brian
2 Likes
I’ve read the comments and know I’ll be the dissenting voice here, but I do see differences. I have almost no experience comparing renderings to actual, but my “custom” wedding ring was supposedly an exact copy of a cocktail ring in the retailer’s shop (not necessarily a copyright issue, just I think he oversold his skills). He missed the mark and I’ve been disappointed with my ring for 40 years (marriage is still good though).
So, what strikes me first is the difference in the width of the metal circle outside the lettering compared to the inside. The rendering has a much thicker outside ring. Although the rendering appears oval, I assume that is the result of the photographic angle and that the client wanted round.
I also feel there’s a difference between the width of the shank as it approaches the head (please pardon any inaccurate terminology) Shouldn’t it be fatter, and more curved? The final piece seems more slender and more rigid/less fluid than the drawing. Or maybe I’m viewing the 2 while thinking of my 1967 class ring - were they made fatter and heftier then?
But as far as the enameling and the shield design and lettering, WOW! They’re perfect!
Mary P
Cinzilla Design, formerly White Branch Designs
It’s interesting… one advantage of generating a rendering is that it comes from the same file that is used to mill the wax. So perception aside, not to be difficult, but there really can’t be any material differences in the render vs the final piece. It’s not subjective - the model that produces the rendering is the exact model that produces the wax.
Now sometimes, one can render something that is not actually able to be manufactured, and then the manufacturer modifies it to make it print/mill correctly, and therefore makes something different… that happens quite often to folks who don’t have a tight process for QC at the modeling stage of custom design. And sometimes the resolution of the rendering so far exceeds the resolution of the actual wax that the customer’s expectations of quality are unreasonably inflated at the outset. The former does not happen with us, because we have standards that are applied prior to sending the model to be manufactured. The latter does not happen, because we are very careful to manage expectations.
If someone changes their mind and doesn’t want to pay, though, not much we can do 
We don’t have a process for that yet!
Hi Jo,
Beautiful work!
The woven/ braided/knitted(?) chain is very unique! I have never seen anything so fine! Did you make it as well?
If not, may I ask where you found it?
I can see how your client would want to wear the piece everyday! I would also!
Julie
Hi Seth,
I was looking at the photos again and wanted to ask…is the height of the enameling on the actual ring flush with the top of the lettering? Or is it recessed? (the actual looks recessed?, the render looks flush… but it could be a figment of my imagination…)
just curious…I made an enameled signet ring for my husband…I could not decide which would be better…to make the enamel flush with the top of the design (grind flush like inlay…my dragon was not 3D, but rather, it was flat topped))…or if it would be better/ more durable to make the enamel recessed/ fileted around the perpendicular walls of the design,or if perhaps I should end with clear enamel over the whole top, covering the silver completely (but I was afreaid the thin layers over the elements might crack off…)
I ended up grinding flush flat…the silver dragon surface is exposed…
your thoughts?
Julie
no it is recessed and the lettering is raised.
Hi,
ok, yes I think that is the nicest look…I am going to try that next…
Julie
Julie- It was a vintage chain that we bought from a source we have for old
stuff. do know how to make nice chains. I learned form a SE Asian refugee.
However I am too old and worn out to do that any more.
-Jo
This is shop talk more than disagreement as the two images are essentially the same. Also I’m a cad user as well as a wax carver so I’m not with the cad resistance.
The issue with cad renderings is this. The rendering is of the file before it is cast, which is different than how the piece will look after it’s finished. In an engagement ring render the prongs are up, not laid over and beaded or rounded, no bright cutting is done and no final shaping. There is always material loss as you go from rough casting to finished. Done well it’s still noticeable. It’s really the stone setting that changes the appearance from render to finished. If you make the file look like it will when finished, then that’s not the model you want to cast because you won’t have adequate material to set, no matter how good you are.
That’s what goes through my mind when you describe your standards and checks Seth. It’s not all automated and still requires a good deal of hand work that certainly can and sometimes should change the look. Usually for the better.
A little off topic, I prefer to give customers colored sketches done by hand rather than renders, even when I’ll use cad to produce the model. The reason is that it will take an hour at least to create the model that can be rendered. When I sketch I can give them four variations of their goal in the same amount of time. Giving them more choice. In addition I think the sketches show the hand of the artist and impart a feeling of old world craftsmanship, which I feel is deeper and warmer than the coldness of a computer render. Maybe that’s just me.
Mark
Mark - an awesome, thoughtful, and very helpful reply It’s ironic - we are moving in just the direction you describe. We sketch or watercolor prior to moving to CAD, and then we manage expectations very closely as they relate to the rendering.
I agree with you 100% on the old world feeling. Many thanks for this insightful reply!
Interesting discussion here. The nature of what we see and how we see it is very odd. The best birding books still tend to have artistic representations of birds as well as a photo. The same with medical texts.
For me I will always draw my projects because I see the process of how I will build it in the strokes of my pencil. There is a mental connection in hand drafting that just doesn’t exist any place else.
Mark- Thanks. I am getting ready to propose a workshop in counter top hand
rendering. I find that when Tim and I draw what we are going to make in
front of the customer we have a 90-95% close rate. It really builds
confidence in the customer that we can do what we say.
Have fun and make lots of jewelry.
-Jo
www.timothywgreen.com
1 Like
One thing that also hasn’t been mentioned which I’ve noticed over the years is that the more precise the drawing, the more exact the expectations. By using such a realistic rendering such as the CAD image, the client develops a very clear, clean-cut expectation of the piece. With an artistic drawing, there’s more room for interpretation. They have a general idea of what it will look like, but it isn’t so firmly nailed down in their mind. . .it becomes more of a ballpark concept of what it will be rather than “EXACTLY. LIKE.THIS.” When presented with their piece, their mind has more flexibility in ignoring any subtle discrepancies between the sketch and the finished item.
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Wow. I’m terribly curious what the client said was different. Did he point out anything???
You should advertise the ring in a Newcastle University newsletter–you may have a whole new business here…:-)…!