How about using for most of the jewelry work a torch like this https://www.ottofrei.com/Handy-Flame-Butane-Torch I smashed my dominate hand 6 years ago and now it’s held together with what I call a plate and bailing wire. I have hand strength, but my hand will shake if I grasp anything heavy for very long. Ys it’s butane, but it is the godzilla of butane torches. I’ve used it for everything short of melting for casting. You learn how to handle it with all the various needs.
Northern California has strict laws about propane tanks. Comes from idiots trying to use propane bar b cues on balconies unattended, and burning down apartment complexes. What I did with the larger propane tank torches was to do it all in my garage. I backed the cars out, nd closed the garage door down to just the width of my baseball bat I put under it. Then I would open the garage side door and have a fan in front of it blowing outward. It caused a nice gentle flow of air through the whole room. Afterwards I would just close everything, roll (Had the soldering table on wheels) the table back to the side, and put the cars back in the garage. A little effort, but sa lot of safety. Also have a good up to date fire extinguisher near.
on the fire extinguisher! I was a volunteer firefighter for many years, so I’m super careful. That why I’m so darn hesitant about the different gasses. I’m most comfortable with acetylene b/c that’s been what I used the most for 12 yrs. Its the only system I’ve never had a horrible experience with…Although the move isn’t happening right away, we will be moving into a house with a garage - most likely Riverside or Orange County.
I guess my only other choice would be to find a maker space and do all my soldering, heat colorization and recycling silver scrap there. Inconvenient as all fell though, and takes away my ability to be as creative as I want.
I currently have that issue - my studio is16miles away and I am barely there due to health problems. It would sure be great to create in my own home, like so many people do.
Myself and many others have posted about using 1 lb. camp stove propane cylinders and medical O2 generators to run a propane and O2 torch. I use both a Meco and Little Torch on the same setup. The only challenge I have it melting large amounts of brass and copper scrap. I regularly solder heavy 8 gauge round wire twisted bracelets and do up to 50 gram melts for scrap recovery. Like you, I worked with acetylene for many years on a B tank and Prest-O-Lite torch system. I wanted to move to a more controled flame and get as much compressed gas out of my shop as I could. After several iterations, I settled on that described above. The only other solution that I considered was a natural gas booster. You can go to my website to see pictures of my shop and torch set up. Good luck…Rob
I have never hear the Little Torch described “Pooping”. They may “pop”, especially on acetylene. You may be thinking of the EZ Torch, that does, upon occassion, excreet something nasty when it is first used. The only explanation I have heard for this behavior is that there is some residue in the hose that has to work its way out. I also run an EZ Torch on a 1 lb. camp stove cylinder and use it mainly for annealing. There are orchid people who use them for all of their work. I never found them to produce enough heat to do what I need to do. They are fairly inexpensive and you can get adapters that will allow you to run them on 1 lb. camp stove cylinders or regular 20 lb. grill type propane cylinders. Look at natural gas concentrators. They are expensive, but the only option for some jewelers who work in large office buildings. The logic being that there is no gas stored under pressure. I would do the research so you know your options but hold off buying anything until you get to where you are going as there may be other outside factors that will impact what you buy once you get there. Lots in the archives, so do some looking as others may have different ideas…Rob
Propane
Oxygen
(Order of turning on the valves)
Oxygen
Propane
(Order of turning on the valves)
I didn’t make it up - I learned it from MassArt students!
(I’ve dredged the archives. I asked b/c I need current info tho b/c options and rules re gas tanks in private dwellings change, and vary from town/city to town/city. I’m doing the deep dive in the archives on Delft casting - and found new alternatives!!)
I think you all have covered the options here pretty well. There are “water torches” from China for $125 to $200 on ebay. The propane 1 lb bottle plus concentrator has already been covered. Using two little bottles, both oxygen and propane, is only slightly less safe. It’s cheapest to refill the 1 lb bottles from a 20 lb barbecue tank, but only slightly more expensive to use bought 1 lb bottles. You would have to do a lot of torch work to use more than a 1 lb tank every few weeks. Then there is the natural gas booster that Rob mentioned, but I think that comes in at a much higher price and depends on there being natural gas available at the street. Any of these options would work for the majority of jewelry work. Will be interested to hear what the OP chooses. -royjohn
I tend to go with the simplest set up for my work. Simple can have a broad definition I have learned. I suspect that were acetylene available on Sundays in Central New York I’d still be using a Presto Lite torch or a similar set up. I traded off for the Smith Little Torch because Propane can be bought at the grocery and I worked for an agency that had oxygen concentrators to lend. I still have my B tanks and regulators and hose however. Rob and I do similar work to some degree and very often I find we have done the same experiments with similar results. All things being equal I would use NG if the equipment was remotely affordable and it served my needs. Were I starting out now instead of 35 years ago using my Dad’s gear, I probably would go with the Little Torch. I was coming from a ship building job and I knew gas and oxygen pretty well.
My advice is to look long and hard at what you want to do right now. Spend the money on the system that will do that job even if it costs a little more. Nothing is harder than doing professional work with inadequate tools. A good torch and a good rolling mill I would max out a credit card for. The rest of the stuff I would buy as needed.
This is exactly what I use — oxygen concentrator and camping gas (propane) canisters. I buy in a twin pack at Lowes. This has been my setup since 2016. My studio is in a spare bedroom. BTW - acetylene is a dirty fuel. I wouldn’t use it indoors for that reason alone. Also, oxygen under pressure is as dangerous as either type of gas and has a lower combustion temp.
Every single jewelry school here in Massachusetts uses simple acetylene torches. Thats how most of us are taught.
All have exhausts. I am fine setting up exhausts - I’ve done several,
The jewelry schools here that do have one combo torch do not allow/rarely allow general student use because of extra danger - and make it clear how dangerous the 2 gas torches are if not turned on precisely or the pressure is accidentally too high. (as explained in the manual someone kindly posted).
Only time I was observing someone (a professionally trained and/experienced jeweler use a propane/o2 little torch, the darn thing malfunctioned. Not sure exactly what happened, but her hair and a shelf full of supplies above her folder area got burned. Not a pleasant experience.
What I’m hearing and reading here is scaring the hell out of my husband - now there us no way he is going to allow any kind of gas torch system in our new home. It took me 2 yrs to get him OK with acetylene (with exhaust of course) - but in SoCal it’s probably not an option. If I can get away with it, I’m sticking with what I know as it is straightforward to use. I have a fantastic vent fan I’ll bring with me.
All I want to do is make jewelry.
It’s all I have left now that I’m older with medical issues.
I’m not forging blades for gawd’s sake.
I cannot do something that will risk us losing our home insurance or violating the rules of our HOA…
Hello Lori,
I read your comments with dismay, because over several years and a couple of different propane plus oxygen torches (Little Torch, Hoke Torch) I have been unable to have anything really dangerous happen in lighting or using the torch. IDK what your “professionally trained and/or experienced jeweler” did to have her accident, but I haven’t experienced it or even heard about it on this forum. You adjust your regulator to the proper pressure, turn on your gas, light your torch and then add oxygen as needed to get your flame right. It is a simple process. If you were to use entirely too much gas, or turn on both gas and oxygen before lighting the torch, I suppose you could end up with some humongous flame that would cause problems, but in the normal course of things, this would not happen.
You should certainly go with what you feel most comfortable with and go on and make jewelry happily ever after, but propagating the idea that gas plus oxygen torches are unsafe and dangerous is not something I would like to see on this forum, as it just isn’t true. As someone else pointed out, there are actually more dangerous things that can go wrong with an acetylene tank than propane and oxygen. The greatest danger of propane is a leak that can allow the heavier than air propane to pool along the floor and mix with air, but with a 1 lb tank, there is precious little propane to pool and the tank and regulator are easy to work with. As with any torch, you would want to check your hoses for leaks and turn off your gas when finished, back off your regulator and empty your gas line afterwards.
As stated before, you could get all the advantages of gas + oxygen with no tanks at all by using a water torch and they are available cheap from China these days. They are the only kind of torch that the fire marshal will allow in a shopping mall, so you could look into that.
Fear is not necessarily a rational response and in fact is more usual with things we don’t really understand. I hope we will all think for ourselves when deciding on our tools. -royjohn
i am pondering your quandry, and it sounds like you are getting boxed in…?
based on what you have written
you want to make jewelry
you need a torch to make jewelry
you want to stay with acetylene
you want to avoid butane, propane/oxy
you need to comply with insurance and hoa rules
so…it sounds like
you need a torch
you need to comply
…it sounds like you need to choose a compliant torch, that you can learn how to use safely, so that you feel comfortable and want to use it
Thank you for your responses, Royjohn.
I’m not trying to propagate fear - I am merely explaining my life experiences. I understand that gas choice amongst jewelers is akin to politics - everyone has an opinion as to what is right/best based on their experience.
I am not sometone that just learned off YouTube - I took proper classes and had a few mentors. I worked in a metalwork shop (jewelry to welding). I am educated. I’ve just seen bad things happen/had bad things happen (and not just with torches). Maybe others haven’t - but I have. I’m fortunate that I have had these experiences - it gave me a healthy respect for the tools I use in my craft.
I seriously appreciate all responses - I am hoping for local support about realistic options - other smiths that understand the challenges of balancing wanting to do the thing you love without having major legal issues in SoCal. CA has unique laws and regulations and I am moving into a planned community. I get/got a lot of help and support where I live now - there are lots of people that understand the challenges of my current state. If I was moving to TN, for example, this wouldn’t even be an issue.
Everyone keeps mentioning water torches - but no one seems to remember that I already said I had TWO. One from China and one from Rio. They were horrible. I couldn’t even give them away. They are in a junk metal pile somewhere now. They are definitely something I would not ever chose to use again, much less own.
Butane is also off the table for me. I won’t detail it here since that is considered negativity, but - nope. I will never own a butane “creme brûlée” torch again.
Home studios - look at the “mouth” torch which uses small bottles of propane and your own breath to create a good flame. If you are defeated with the notion of circular breathing, a foot operated bellows also works. another option is an orca torch. Or if you have natural gas, you can use it directly with compressed air - not an oxygen tank. Or if you feel the need for having a flash back arrestor, you could use a G-tec concentrator for natural gas like the jewelers in NYC use with the fire department’s blessing.
Judy Hoch
Hi Judy! Thanks! This is exactly the type of info I need! Ill screenshot your message for reference!
Our new home may have NG…didn’t even give that a thought (even tho I use my stove in my condo now to ball wire on the regular if I am working on simple projects at home.)
Circular breathing is a concept i’m familiar with (band geek from HS).
Join the Facebook page group run by alan Revere. He taught jewelry making in his school in San Francisco for decades. Only recently did he close it and move to only mentoring. He still lives in California in the bay area. Ask him about the restrictions California has currently. As for where in So Cal. You need lets put it this way YOU NEED to ask the local fire department of the neighborhood you are moving to about restrictions. THEY will know better than anyone here. As for your communities HOA, you have to ask them what restrictions they have. We give you suggestions, but so far nothing is good. Go to the source of what you need. Funny thing is I moved from Nashville to San Francisco in 97. I’ve seen many careless accidents by people who were not concentrating on their work. Worst was a lady visiting teacher who nearly cut off her hand in a bandsaw accident. I went on to learn all about bandsaws and now own one of the big whoppers. As for creme bruelee torches, 99% are crap for doing jewelry and most are made in China. There are a few brands that are exceptions to the theory of being bad. I had the nozzle of one fall off while I was soldering. Then there is the problem of having enough heat to do the job. I currently use one made in Japan that sushi chefs use. Great little torch and I do most my work with it. I have 8 torches that range from that small sushi torch to one of propane and air used by forest service to clear weeds. the later shoots a flame nearly 3 feet long and sounds like a cannon when you light it. I have everything in between and different gasses. I’m a closet pyromaniac.
Again go to the source of who will know the answers to your questions.
Judy’s message reminded me that in the’90’s I used an alcohol lamp and blowpipe to make chain. There are lots of small jobs you could do with this and it’s probably safer than most other options. I apologize for not reading closely Lori’s original post re: the water torches. I looked at a report on the LA jewelry district and evidently, from what I could see, you could use gas/oxygen torches, but apparently they specify exactly how (it was a long report and I didn’t read all of it).
Lori, I think your biggest hurdle could be your condo’s covenants, as they can specify all kinds of things including the color of the flowers in your window boxes. I suppose if it’s inside your dwelling, you could sneak a lot of stuff, but if they find out, they can order you to cease and desist. You can find out what the county requires from the fire marshal, but the covenants, as you may already know, can be more restrictive than that.
Good luck and I hope you make lots of beautiful jewelry! -royjohn
on the fire extinguisher! I was a volunteer firefighter for many years, so I’m super careful. That why I’m so darn hesitant about the different gasses. I’m most comfortable with acetylene b/c that’s been what I used the most for 12 yrs. Its the only system I’ve never had a horrible experience with…Although the move isn’t happening right away, we will be moving into a house with a garage - most likely Riverside or Orange County.