Hi Wendy,
Be careful, though, syringe solder isn't very strong!!
Could you provide the name of any paste solder mfgrs that have
published specifications for the solders they mfgr? I’d be
interested in comparing the published strength figures of solders
to those of the metals being used.
Thanks,
Dave
Nancy, Did you accidently touch the tip of the syringe to the warm piece of metal? That can harden the solder in the tip. What I do is use a piece of small broken sawblade to unjam it or if that is too big use the fine wire that binds the sawblades together. Be careful, though, syringe solder isn't very strong!! I like it for things like repairing hollow rope chains and tacking heads into place.
Wendy, Not only accidentally, I touched the syringe to the metal
on purpose. Now that you explain it. . . . Duh! Well . . . sure
makes sense. Won’t do that again. Broken sawblades, yes! On the
bench they are as indispensable to me as duct tape is every where
else in the my world. Its amazing all the things you can do with
them. Hey, maybe that would be a good topic “What I do with
broken sawblades”??
Thanks for the tip Wendy,
Nancy
Very interesting post. Jerry Harr a well known silver-smith,
teacher here in San Diego County, has long been an advocate of
paste solder soft, medium and hard. He has a small metal stone
scoop onto which he places a small amount of paste solder. He
heats the area to be soldered and then using a titanium pick,
places the paste at the joint(s) and uses a hand held Blazer torch
to finish off the job.
He teaches this way and I have seen him do a fire brick full of
links for his chains with NO mishaps.
Teresa Masters
Hi, I am writting a lesson about soldering and brasing and I
would like to have the avises of paste solder users. I am not
using this kind of solder but I would like to write some lines
about it. What are the pros and cons. Thanks Vincent Guy Audette
the only time i used paste solder was to repair things like rope
chain. in rare occations you need the solder to stick without
holding it. otherwise use conventional solder.
I am a big fan of paste solder! I use it for connecting small
pieces of wire and attaching other embellishments. For me, its
like having a glue to hold the pieces in place. The drawbacks
are that your metal (as always) must be fastidiously clean and
you must be careful not to over apply. If you use too much it
will spread and make an unsightly pool. I use hard, medium, and
easy dependent on the application. Never let the tip of the
syringe touch the hot torch as then the paste will harden within
the needle point, and keep the syringes in an airtight container
to prevent drying out. As Mikey’s older brother says, “try it,
you’ll like it”.
Nancy Bernardine-Widmer
Bernardine Art Jewelry
http://web.wt.net/~nbwidmer
Hello Guy,
would like to have the avises of paste solder users. I am not using this kind of solder but I would like to write some lines about it. What are the pros and cons.
I have found t to be very convenient in that it’s easy to place
and is pre-fluxed. There are no fiddly pallions to cut and store
and it allows me to set up parts more easily as it is almost
glue-like before soldering.
The main disadvantages are that as it warms it can run off a
piece and I’ve never had much success when soldering very large
pieces together so I tend to use conventional solder for large
belt buckles that might require flow soldering.
Just my twopence,
Kerry
Kerry McCandlish Jewellery - Celtic and Scottish styles
Commission/Custom Work undertaken…http://www.bennie.demon.co.uk
Katunayake, Creagorry, Isle of Benbecula, HS7 5PG SCOTLAND
Tel: +44 1870-602-677 Fax: +44 1870-602-956 Mobile: +44 850-059-162
Vincent,
I have used paste solders before attaching commercial bezel cups
to stamped and domed discs. It is useful in that the cups really
don’t move once placed and they also do not “jump” around as you
heat the piece either from liquid flux or damp solder chips
“popping”. It is almost as if the paste acts as a glue to hold
the pieces in place.
Once thing I will stress though, USE ONLY IN A WELL VENTILATED
AREA WITH A PROPER RESPIRATOR AND FILTER PACK ATTACHED!!! Fiber
filter masks will not do at all. The gases given off from the
paste solder are very bad for you (unfortunately I found out the
hard way) as some of the floride based fluxes form hydrofloric
acid gas when they decompose in the heat of soldering. I had one
safety supply house refuse to sell me anything less than a full
face fresh air mask (no filters, a pumped in supply of fresh
outside air).
Persoanally, I find paste solder useful but only if you are
doing production type numbers. You have to balnce the benefits
of it along with the safety risks. Also, those using belt ovens
will find paste solder very, very useful, but will find that they
need to have special formulas for thier particular application.
Mike Malon at Silver Streak in Tempe, Arizona uses paste solder
almost totally in his belt oven.
Hope that helps.
Cheers,
Harry Butterfield
//////////////////////////////
Harry and Penny Butterfield
HP WorkShop
Hand-Crafted Precious Metal Art
@hpwrkshp
http://www.island.net/~hpwrkshp
///////////////////////////////
Guy, I used some commercial paste solder once. It was handy, but
it dried out quickly in the syringe. Now I make my own by filing
solder, run a magnet through the filings, add a little white
Handy flux, forget the syringe and use a toothpick to put a blob
where I want it. As far as I can tell it works just as well.
Because the solder is in small particles, it reaches flow temps
quickly. Necessity/mother/invention and all that. Try it–you
probably already have everything you need.
I know some may turn up their noses at paste solder, but
personally I swear by it. It stays where you put it and goes
where you want it. Particularly the gold; it has made some very
tricky soldering jobs much easier for me.
Janet Kofoed
fine handcrafted jewelry
http://www.voicenet.com/~kkofoed/jewelry.html
No kidding about the paste solder! I, as well, only use it to
repair rope chains or to tack heads in place before soldering.
Recently I thought I could get away with soldering a cluster top
onto a bracelet slide with the paste solder. It fell off the
first time the customer wore it. Boy was I embarassed! Don’t
trust the stuff for anything important! Wendy Newman
Harry:
How much paste solder do you use? It would have to be an awful
lot to make the cloud of gas you describe. I’ve been using it
for hollow items and very fine chains in very small amounts for
years and NEVER had anything like what you describe happen.
Reguards;
Steve K.
No kidding about the paste solder! I, as well, only use it to repair rope chains or to tack heads in place before soldering. Recently I thought I could get away with soldering a cluster top onto a bracelet slide with the paste solder. It fell off the first time the customer wore it. Boy was I embarassed! Don't trust the stuff for anything important!
Have to disagree. Paste solder when properly used is as strong
as other solders.
I recently made a sterling bracelet with 12 ga, 4.5 mm oval
links. Half were soldered before assembly with hard paste, the
other half were soldered after assembly with medium paste. After
soldering, the brace would lie flat & could be shaped by filing
into a typical man’s ID bracelet. No joints broke during the
twisting process.
When using paste solder, be sure to get the item hot enough for
the solder to flow. I’ve had instances where the flux(?) formed
sort of a crust around the area & the solder never really flowed.
The 2 parts were held firmly together until the pickle dissolved
the crust. Re-soldering , with paste, resolved the problem.
Give yourself a little time to get the ‘hang’ of soldering with
paste. Your 1st experiences with chips & wire probably weren’t
100% successful either.
Dave
Theoretically, paste solder was the ideal solution to working
with small stuff like jump rings, pin backs, etc. I tried it,
and it worked fine—for a while. BUTWhat do you do with
perfectly petrified paste the next time you try to use it? The
second time I tried it, I made sure the stock was very fresh, and
I stored it according to directions. Nevertheless, within a
month it was inextrudable (is that a word?) So, the heck with
it. The old methods work well, and until someone comes up with a
way to keep paste solder from hardening itself to death in its
container, I’ll stick with paillons and wire.
Steve, I use it in sterling silver production and I do not use
more than a samll dab on the back of commercial bezel cups (8mm).
The dab is about 1mm square. Also in soldering a samll disk to
the top of a larger disk, i use paste solder. The dab is a bit
larger as the small disk is about 22mmx27mm. When I solder
these, I am usually soldering between 50 to 100 at a whack. The
paste I use is a 56% silver solder and is made with a very high
concentration of flourides in it. It was described as being
"very aggressive" and it soldered very well. The safety supply
house that I was ordering the respirator from asked the
ingredients. I went to the manufacturer and got the basics (read
trade secrets) which I related to the safety supply folks who
contacted 3M. 3M faxed a faq sheet regarding the materials used
and what they break down to when heated. Hydroflouric acid was
one of the products.
Something of note here. If you read the ingredients on most
commercial fluxes available, they are mostly floride salts of
something or other. The vapour/gases produced from hight temp
applications, i.e. soldering, does make for a less than healthy
work environment, thus the warning about good ventilation and
such. I think, based on my experiences, that the warnings should
be taken very seriously especially if you do large prodcution
runs using either paste solders or floride type fluxes.
In very small amounts, as you use, it probably is not too bad at
all. However, when used in larger scale I think it does pose a
health hazard.
Hope this clears things up a bit. Anyone else, please throw
your 2 cents worth in as health in the workshop/studio is a very
important thing especially if you have employees.
Cheers,
Harry
I use paste solder all of the time and rather than try to
extrude it through the needle, I remove the needle and apply the
paste with the point of a wooden skewer. I am able to get
exactly the amount I need and I rarely have any problem with it.
My question is this: What sort of physical problems are caused
by exposure to the flourides? - Deb
About Paste Solder, There are times when just the portion
closest to the tip hardens a bit and becomes difficult to move
through. I have gone with a long needle from the top through the
tip and gotten through. I assure you the solder is still very
useable. I take out some of the hardened stuff and mix it with a
small drop of Pripps Flux, and solder away. My biggest problem
was getting the plunger to stay back in the syringe, I finally
did this by putting a needle through from the tip in creating a
bit of an airway.
My original teacher, and still mentor Jerry Harr is a firm
believer in Paste Solder. Teresa
Here’s one way that may work to soften your ‘stiffened in the
syringe’ paste solder.
Heat the syringe under a lamp with about a 60 watt light bulb.
Don’t get the bulb too close to the syringe (about 4-6 inches).
About 5 - 10 minutes is usually sufficient to soften the paste.
The syringes are generally made of some polyethylene type plastic
& if this plastic gets heated over about 350-400 F it’ll melt.
Until you’ve developed an experience level with the time required
to soften the paste you’re using, it may be worthwhile to try
several time intervals. Usually, a small drop of liquid can be
seen forming at the tip of the needle when the warmed paste is
becoming soft enough to extrude.
Several other things I’ve found handy when using paste solder
aRe:
1. Always ask the supplier for a tube of solder with the newest date.
2. Use a needle cleanout/plug wire for each needle.
3. Use a handle to hold the tube & a pad on the plunger when squeezing out the
solder.
Here’s how to make the clean out needles & handles.
Clean out needles
Purchase some music wire from a hardware or model shop. Get a
size that just goes into the needles you’re using (usually 0.020
& 0.025"). Music wire is very stiff & not easily bent
accidentally. It’s usually sold in 36" lengths. Both pieces will
probably be less than $1.
Cut off a piece about 2 inches long. Bend it at 90 deg… about
1/4 from one end. Insert it into the appropriate needle.
Syringe holder & pad
This tool allows the syringe to be held easier & more force to
be applied when squeezing solder.
Cut a 2 1/4" long piece of 1 inch inside diameter PVC pipe.
Drill a 3/4" hole through the pipe 1 1/8" from the end. The
hole should be perpendicular to the centerline of the pipe & go
through both sides of the pipe. (Most paste solder syringes are
aprox 3/4" in dia…, if yours is a different diameter, adjust the
hole size accordingly.)
Cut the pipe in half down the long axis so the holes are
approximately centered in each half.
Round the corners & smooth all the edges with a file or
sandpaper.
Purchase a 1/2" PVC pipe cap for each holder you make.
Apply a drop or 2 of PVC cement to one side of the inside of
the pipe cap. This is is used to hold the cap on the plunger top.
Use any glue compatible with PVC.
To use, insert the syringe through the hole from the concave
side of the pipe. Place the PVC pipe cap over the plunger. Use
the syringe in the usual manner.
You might want to make several (1 for each type of solder
used).
Dave
There are times when just the portion
closest to the tip hardens a bit and becomes difficult to move through.
Paste solder is pretty much all I use, but I find those leeetle
tiny needle-tips less than useless. Generally, I chuck the
tiny-tip out, and keep the cap on to prevent drying, but I do so
much soldering, it really doesn’t have a chance to dry out. Note:
hard paste solder drys very quickly, medium and easy less so. To
use, I squeeze a wee amout of the solder out. I then place the
solder with a toothpick. With bezels, gently scrape a very small
amount of solder at intervals around the bottom edge of the
bezel, before placing it. Works wonderfully for me. Besides, like
I said some threads ago, I hate those tiny pallions leaping all
about when I’m in a hurry.
Lisa, (raining, saving me from watering the garden) Topanga, CA USA
hi,
about 24 years ago, i had some paste solder and thought it
worked great, until i had to use it the second time. now i’ve
read all the posts about how to keep it from clogging up like
someones arteries who has a steady diet of bacon and butter.
one can get the same efffect as past solder by simply filing the
solder and mixing it into ones preferred flux.
my paste solder is on the same shelf as my presnipped solder. i
just haven’t seen that shelf in a loong time.
best regards,
geo fox