Metal Mold and Die Making (Pantograph)

Jeff,
Welcome to the ranks of 'University/College (Back-door) ‘Professoring’. .
Guess we’ll have to refer/call you, “Prof Jeff” or would you prefer the more
formal title, “Professor Everett”??(Much to long to write for a 'Fat
Fingered Typest).

Jim

At 11:14 PM 10/17/96 -0500, you wrote:

Charles D. Eichhorn
miracle@ssi.parlorcity.com writes:

To:
Kenneth Gastineau

I have been watching a lot of Email since I join this forum, I am very
hesistant about answering any, but I seen yours and thought I would
share something that I learned. I have been a bench jeweler for the
past 17 years, I do designing, repair, casting, manufacturing, etc…
I can get myself into one to many things sometimes, I spend a great deal
of money buying the best equipment and tools, to get to the point
though, I spent about $300.00 on this “polymer” junk modeler. Did not
get the results that I seen at the Tucson MJSA show where it was
displayed. Called factory, etc… product just can not get fine results.

I designed a non-traditional class ring for a college utilizing their
logo, to begin manufacturing started I started by contacting others in
the large manufacturing of rings, etc… They said to have a metal model
made, so I did. Best advice ever, the company I used was Emblematic
Tool & Design in Cincinnati, OH. They reproduced the very detailed logo
from a laser line drawing print out from my computer. They also
injected the plastic for me, well work the time saved for me. They are
proffessional in what they do. I do repair for 5 stores,so I am very
busy, and could never have reproduced the quality of this companys work.
If you got a high quality item to reproduce check them out, make your
money at the bench.

Charles:

Someone once said “Shoemaker tend to thy lasts”, I agree. I do not work
exclusively as a bench jeweler, but as a small manufacturer of brass and
sterling jewelry. I am in the process of learning die and mold making, this
is the area of development that I am most interested as a craftsman. As an
artist I am interested in making my own molds and dies as to have more
influence over the translation of artwork into tooling. I know this goes
against what might seem the most profitable pursuit, but who knows.

Over the years I have tried to keep as much of our processing “in house”.
While many jewelers I know jobbed out their casting, I built my own foundry
and learned the necessary skills to do production casting ( it took me ten
years, but who’s counting). I can now profitably produce castings for what
I would be paying to have them done (or less). This helps to keep me
employed. I am hoping that learning to make my own molds and dies will do
the same.

Recently I considered having metal molds produced by some other business.
The cost of the molds would be around $250 to $400 each. Every year I will
need 24 or more molds to be made, not to mention other work that can be
done with the same equipment. I have been able to set myself up with an
engraving machine and cutter grinder for less than $2000 (used, of course).

I do not do general repair work and or custom work. If I did this I would
not have time to make tooling either. We repair only the jewelry we make
and generally have less than 10 repairs to do per year.

I have also set up a small machine shop in my studio, an old Logan lathe
with lots of tooling, a mill drill, an old Atlas shaper. These machines
have come in handy many times to build jigs and tools and even parts for
jewelry. I suppose that I could have jobbed this work out. Don’t get me
wrong, I am not a master machinist by any stretch of the imagination, but I
enjoy learning and doing a variety of tasks and can perform these tasks
when I need them, not when some other business can get around to it.

I bought the same Model Master that you bought for around $300. I was
disappointed at first, but learned to work with the polymer and it has more
than paid for itself. I didn’t realize that it is just a box with little
ultraviolet lights inside. I use a hair dryer on the polymer periodically
to keep it from getting too soft. I have since taken Jeffrey’s advice and
also use the ultrasonic cleaner.

I suppose what one chooses to do it is a matter of economic choices,
depending on the area you are located. Here in Central Kentucky
(Appalachia) the opportunities for jewelers are different than in large
cities.

Anyway Charles, I appreciate your advice and take it with the kindness and
consideration in which you gave it. I think you are correct, I am just too
eccentric to do anything about it. Thanks

Kenneth Gastineau
gastin@mis.net

Kenneth, it sounds like you’re doing pretty good. To get halfway through
a steel die before you snap the tip of the cutter is GOOD! :slight_smile:

I wish I could afford one of the new desktop EDM units. If you need me
to ask around who does EDM inexpensively I could do that. The place I
used to work at (Metal Arts Group in Seattle) has an older EDM but it
works well. You could try there, but there are probably less expensive
places around, especially in the north-east.

I’m cutting into annealed tool steel to make what is called an imprinting
die or stamp.
Similar to a coining die but not as sculptured.

I used a 6:1 tracing master. This hopefully helps to slow down the cutter
movement.
I believe the cutter is super micrograin carbide. I got halfway through
engraving the design on the 1" round steel blank before I had any serious
problems. I just don’t have the experience to know when I am screwing up.
The best way to make these dies is to cut them into machinable graphite and
EDM them. I am going to try and find a shop that will do that reasonably.
Until then I guess it is slow and easy.

I am also needing to make injection molds. Just haven’t started that
project yet. I will take your advice and try aluminum.

Thanks.

Kenneth Gastineau
gastin@mis.net

         Jeffrey Everett

Handmade 18K, 22K, and platinum gemstone fine jewelry.
Diamond setting, rubber/metal molds, casting, lapidary
Die and mold engraving, plastic patterns for casting.
Cad jewelry design, cad/cam milling scroll filigree…
P O Box 2057 Fairfield IA 52556 515-469-6250

Hi Charles, glad you delurked!

I agree, the photopolymer units do not give the kind of detail you need,
but they do have their place.

I do the same kind of work as Emblematic Tool, but on a much smaller
scale. I engrave metal molds and inject them with plastic, and am able
to get extremely fine detail. I do this for other manufacturing
jewelers.

I’m working on a mold now. It is for a ring. The top has two banners
with enameled lettering surrounding a shield that has a three
dimensional phoenix with its wings spread and more lettering and enamel
below it. A real pain job.
I’ll upload a gif of the finished ring when I get it done.

Jeffrey

Charles D. Eichhorn wrote:

To:
Kenneth Gastineau
gastin@mis.net

I have been watching a lot of Email since I join this forum, I am very
hesistant about answering any, but I seen yours and thought I would
share something that I learned. I have been a bench jeweler for the
past 17 years, I do designing, repair, casting, manufacturing, etc…
I can get myself into one to many things sometimes, I spend a great deal
of money buying the best equipment and tools, to get to the point
though, I spent about $300.00 on this “polymer” junk modeler. Did not
get the results that I seen at the Tucson MJSA show where it was
displayed. Called factory, etc… product just can not get fine results.

I designed a non-traditional class ring for a college utilizing their
logo, to begin manufacturing started I started by contacting others in
the large manufacturing of rings, etc… They said to have a metal model
made, so I did. Best advice ever, the company I used was Emblematic
Tool & Design in Cincinnati, OH. They reproduced the very detailed logo
from a laser line drawing print out from my computer. They also
injected the plastic for me, well work the time saved for me. They are
proffessional in what they do. I do repair for 5 stores,so I am very
busy, and could never have reproduced the quality of this companys work.
If you got a high quality item to reproduce check them out, make your
money at the bench.

         Jeffrey Everett

Handmade 18K, 22K, and platinum gemstone fine jewelry.
Diamond setting, rubber/metal molds, casting, lapidary
Die and mold engraving, plastic patterns for casting.
Cad jewelry design, cad/cam milling scroll filigree…
P O Box 2057 Fairfield IA 52556 515-469-6250

Jeffrey writes:

(snip)

If you need me to ask around who does EDM inexpensively I could do that.
The >place I used to work at (Metal Arts Group in Seattle) has an older EDM
but it
works well. You could try there, but there are probably less expensive
places around, especially in the north-east.

Jeffrey:

I would appreciate some idea about what a good price would be. The dies I
am planning to make are cut about .020" deep and would average about 1 or 2
square inches. For a lower price I could plan to have several cut at a
time. If you know of any reasonable players let me know. If I understand
correctly about EDM, the die blank can already be hardened before
processing, is this correct?

Also is any machinable graphite suitable? I know a fellow who has a whole
pallet of used die forms that could be turned to proper dimensions. He gave
me a piece to try.

You mentioned uploading a picture of a piece you are doing now. Let me know
when you do.

Thanks.

Kenneth Gastineau
gastin@mis.net

From: Jeffrey Everett jeverett@lisco.com
To: orchid@ganoksin.com
Subject: Re: Metal Mold and Die Making (Pantograph).
Date: Monday, October 21, 1996 11:38 PM

Kenneth, it sounds like you’re doing pretty good. To get halfway through
a steel die before you snap the tip of the cutter is GOOD! :slight_smile:

I wish I could afford one of the new desktop EDM units. >

I’m cutting into annealed tool steel to make what is called an
imprinting
die or stamp.
Similar to a coining die but not as sculptured.

I used a 6:1 tracing master. This hopefully helps to slow down the
cutter
movement.
I believe the cutter is super micrograin carbide. I got halfway through
engraving the design on the 1" round steel blank before I had any
serious
problems. I just don’t have the experience to know when I am screwing
up.
The best way to make these dies is to cut them into machinable graphite
and
EDM them. I am going to try and find a shop that will do that
reasonably.
Until then I guess it is slow and easy.

I am also needing to make injection molds. Just haven’t started that
project yet. I will take your advice and try aluminum.

Thanks.

Kenneth Gastineau
gastin@mis.net

             Jeffrey Everett

Handmade 18K, 22K, and platinum gemstone fine jewelry.
Diamond setting, rubber/metal molds, casting, lapidary
Die and mold engraving, plastic patterns for casting.
Cad jewelry design, cad/cam milling scroll filigree…
P O Box 2057 Fairfield IA 52556 515-469-6250

orchid@ganoksin.com

procedures

Kenneth Gastineau wrote:

If I understand

correctly about EDM, the die blank can already be hardened before
processing, is this correct?

Yes, that’s the beauty of EDM (Electrical Disharge Machining, otherwise
known as spark erosion, for those that are unfamiliar with the acronym).
Dies are known to crack during hardening, expecially large bracelet
dies, and do so all too frequently. That’s why Metal Arts Group (called
West Earth when I was there) went to EDM.

Machinable graphite works very well, but erodes quickly. If you need a
polished surface, you’ll need to make two, one for heavy current, and
one for fine (polishing) current.

         Jeffrey Everett

Handmade 18K, 22K, and platinum gemstone fine jewelry.
Diamond setting, rubber/metal molds, casting, lapidary
Die and mold engraving, plastic patterns for casting.
Cad jewelry design, cad/cam milling scroll filigree…
P O Box 2057 Fairfield IA 52556 515-469-6250

TO: Jeffrey Everett

Thank You for your response, I would like to see the *.gif when
completed I enjoy seeing high quality work.