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Invisible rivet for rough diamond?


#1

Hullo everyone,

I hope that 2001 will be a healthy and creative year for all,
especially Dr Aspler.

I have a client who wants a four Cwt quarter inch cube rough diamond
crystal (i.e… 6mm square) set in a large pendant He doesn’t want any
prongs, and wants to show as much of the cube as possible. I can only
think of glueing it into a cup bezel, but hate the thought of that as
I am concerned about the safety. I have heard of a glue called “Crazy
Glue” which is very reliable. Does anyone know where this can be
obtained, and is it available (or something similar) in Australia? Also
I assume that if I solder something in place over the diamond, there
is a chance that the crystal could shatter. The crystal has great
sentimental value.

I would really appreciate any suggestions.

Felicity in sunny West Oz.


#2

Felicity,

The way to is to have the diamond laser drilled with a small hole,
maybe = a millimeter or 2 deep and then pig it.

Etienne


#3

The material you are talking about is a Cyanoacrylate These are
also sold to a more professional market by Loctite . Australian site:
http://www.loctite.com.au/ I don’t think you would want to use
this–but.

A book recently issued in English " The complete book of Jewelry
making" by Carles ( ISBN 1-57990-188-3 (2000) shows a few uses of
diamond rough in jewelry. He would recommend a prong setting. The book
was " La Joyeria" in Spanish. A very nice book. Jesse

Felicity Peters


#4

Felicity -

Please do NOT use super glue for this application. If you determine

that an adhesive is in order, then one of the better UV-curing
epoxies would be a better choice. Super glues (cyanoacrylates) are
both slightly hygroscopic (they draw water into themselves from the
atmosphere) and water-weakening. Not a good combination of
characteristics when you want to create as close to “eternal” a piece
as possible.

Jim Small
Small Wonders


#5

Felicity, do not depend on any instant glue, ( Crazy Glue, Super
Glue, etc.) to hold this stone! These cyanoacrylates all get brittle
and fail! Every single time. It isn’t a question of if they fail,
only when they will fail. An epoxy may be a better bet but if the
stone has any value to the customer I would depend on a tension type
setting hung from a bail. Depending on the orientation of the
crystal, I could see a channel style setting could work as well.

Good luck, Norman

Felicity Peters


#6

Felicity;

I design a lot of jewelry with the same effect…The problem
with those super glues is that if you use too much glue, in a short
time, it will crystallize and your stone will fall out. Also, this
adhesive is very brittle when cured,–Not Good with this type of stone
setting. I have EXCELLENT success with -clear silicon seal-
(G.E.–best) Here in the States, I find this product in any
Home/Hardware store. Any store that sells building materials,and
bath/kitchen accessory hardware… Take care and Do enjoy…

Dave


#7

Hi Felicity,

“Crazy Glue” is a commercial trade name for a specific brand of
cyanoacrylate, or “instant glue”. I wouldn’t use it on anything that
has value as it doesn’t stand up to moisture. (I facet cut stones, and
occasionally use crazy glue to hold the stone to the dop. The joint
will predictably let go unless it’s covered with vaseline to keep the
water off.) If you absolutelu must glue this thing my inclination
would be to use “Araldite” 2 part epoxy, the 24-hour, slow curing
variety.

Cheers,
Hans Durstling
Moncton, Canada


#8

First, I do not use “crazy glue” on any piece I work on…If it is to
be glued I use a good jewelers’ epoxie…There are some better ones
out there but I have found that they come in large quanties and are
very expensive. With care and fire coat you should be able to solder
something over the diamond, but again, I would try to find a design
that uses mechanical fastening…maybe one that hold the top, bottom,
and back points of the crystal. A design like this would show more of
the crystal and with the jewelers’ epoxie and the mechanical
fastening the stone should be safe.


#9

Felicity;

I would suggest you set the cube in a fine gold bezel around the
center square with a jump ring soldered on. I have done this with
faceted stones around the girdle and it works quite well. Use a high
carat gold so it is nice and soft and easy to push. Build a foot in
the bezel for the girdle to set on or else build the bezel in wax with
one side at an angle and the other ready to push. You can do this
directly on the stone and then cast the bezel after removing it from
the stone. Setting should be fairly simple. If you need more detail
email me off orchid and I will do what I can to help. DO NOT USE
CRAZY GLUE. If your customer is concerned about the amount of metal
explain that we all are limited by the laws of physics and you have
yet to discover and antigravity device or one for invisibility…Hope
this helps. Frank Goss

Felicity Peters


#10

Hi Felicity,

I have a client who wants a four Cwt quarter inch cube rough diamond

crystal (i.e… 6mm square) set in a large pendant He doesn’t want any
prongs, and wants to show as much of the cube as possible. I can only
think of gluing it into a cup bezel, but hate the thought of that as
I am concerned about the safety. I have heard of a glue called “Crazy
Glue” which is very reliable. Does anyone know where this can be
obtained, and is it available (or something similar) in Australia? Also
I assume that if I solder something in place over the diamond, there
is a chance that the crystal could shatter. <<

Since he wants to display as much of the stone as possible without
using prongs you might try the following. This assumes the stone is a
cube as you’ve stated.

Mount the stone between 2 cups at opposing corners of the crystal. A
line from one corner to the other would go from the front right hand
corner of the top face to the rear left corner of the bottom face.

The support for the ‘cups’ could be posts that emanate from a back
plate of polished metal. It could also be supported in the center of a
circle made from wire. However this presents a security problem for
the stone unless the circle is very stiff & resists being elongated
releasing the pressure holding the stone.

If it were me, I’d stay away from any kind of ‘glue’. Crazy glue
isn’t very shock resistant. An inadvertent bang against something
solid could cause a crazy glue bond to separate. That’s a technique
that is sometimes used to remove cut stones that have be affixed to
dops with crazy glue.

Good luck!

Dave


#11

Felicity, How about laser drilling a tiny hole to run a ring through
it.You can probably have it done out of house somewhere in Aus. Or
wire wrapping it. Best J Morley Coyote Ridge Studio


#12

Many years ago my husband found a rough diamond he wanted made into a
very simple solitare ring. I cast the ring with the stone in place
and never had a problem with it. As the wax filled all availabe
contours of the stone, I was able to keep the setting open for maximum
visibility.

L.J. Smole
White Fox Workshop
Ozark Mountain, USA


#13
I have heard of a glue called "Crazy Glue"  which is very reliable.
Does anyone know where this can be obtained, and is it available (or
something similar) in Australia? 

Dear Felicity,

“Crazy Glue” and “Super Glue” are trade names for cyanoacrylate glue
and it must be available under some name in Australia. It’s sold in
the US in grocery stores, stationery stores, hobby/art stores and
hardware stores. It’s very common.

However, while cyanoacrylate glue creates extremely strong bonds, I
would not recommend it for the purpose you mention � glueing a rough
diamond into a cap or bezel � for a few reasons: It expands and
contracts with weather variations, it’s brittle, and it is not meant
to be gap-filling. I wouldn’t even trust the slower-acting
formulations that say they are gap-filling; I’d go with a good epoxy
if I absolutely had to resort to glue.

Beth in sunny LA, with a miserable cold and barely enough energy to
do email, let alone anything else.


#14

Hello Felicity,

I am making an off-the-wall suggestion here.  Have you thought about

constructing the piece in Precious Metal Clay (PMC)? Although pricey
and requiring a kiln, you could form the PMC around the rough diamond
so that it is securely held and then fire the whole thing. I’ve
fired CZs and lab rubies in place with no problem. Sort of like
casting in place, but at lower temps. There is some shrinkage in the
gold PMC, and in the case of a ring, an interior sizing mandrel would
be needed. Even though the kiln gradually heats up & cools down
(less chance of heat shock), I’d still check the stone out for heat
sensitive fractures, etc. If you want to pursue this avenue, go to
the website http://www.pmclay.com This sounds like a wonderful
project. Please let us know how you proceeded and the results.
Thanks also to Hanuman for moderating this excellent forum. Judy in
Kansas - looking ahead to Tucson and hopefully meeting several
Orchidians.

Judy M. Willingham, R.S.
Extension Associate
221 Call Hall Kansas State Univerisity
Manhattan KS 66506
(785) 532-1213 FAX (785) 532-5681