How do I remove labradorite cab from bezel. Stuck

Hi Richard,
Thank you for your considered reply and the north American viewpoint.
To widen this discourse, I see it as follows.
Whatever you choose to make, requires a certain skillset.
Whether its in jewellery making, or wooden boat building or even interpreting say, music through stringed, wind or percussive instruments,(Pianoforte) or whatever,
That skill set needs to be,
1stly theoretical, ie study everything what has been done before ,
2nd, the right tools tools to do the task chosen,
3rdly lots and still more years of practice.
4th, a drive to not give up when failure to get the desired result constantly besets the person.
So,
Looking at the frequent posts on this forum from folk like Lorainne and many others, one can see from an experienced eye where their problems lie.
As mentioned in my previous posts, the perspective from here in Europe and particularly the UK is different., most of this forum users are bench jewellers. With the limitations that imposes, much amazing work I must add.
Very few have any industrial jewellery production experience…
Given that scenario im not surprised at the constant problems that folk just shouldnt have in the simplest of tasks.

In my case,I was very fortunate to have a very extensive engineering training in aircraft manufacture and use.

(My parents were fine art collectors in the 1930’s in central Europe, and my father was involved in heavy machine tool production, Hyd presses, rolling mills and extrusion presses)…

Then I had a no of yrs in R&D before deciding the right future for me agedv 34, was to design make and market my own products.
So following the 4 items mentioned above it didnt take long say, 12 months to pull it all together to have marketable products selling direct to the customer.
That was some 50 yrs ago.
I appreciate what folk do with stones, its the traditional jewelley ethos. It was essential that I did something completely different given the established competition, and chose to follow the" wrought" way of making. Tho I can fabricate if I need to, and set stones as well.
One main idea I had in 1968/9 was to explore via the wrought route the art of the torque or cuff, In its historical context. That meant I designed 10 different styles in traditional metals as well as the modern, in jewellery terms the stainless steels and titaniums. With production runs of a minimum of 30 off at one time. I then added finger rings in the same historical theme.
Then put together what ever technology was needed to interpret my ideas. The oddest! is the “Dark Ages” design in 316 s/steel make with TIG .
Our main museum in London for the applied arts, had an exhibition Toward a new iron age, in that iron smiths were forging bowls in iron, I asked myself? can I do that in the bronze metal I was working?
That started another product line. Leading to forging silver up to 8.5lbs in weight and 15in dia, fine pieces.
then in 1987 My aqisition of a complete B’ham 1880’s jewellery workshop. With the minting tools dies , fly presses etc. THAT finally opened the door to real proper production of work that I couldnt do any other way.
Its wonderful to have dreams of making beautiful things BUT it has to fast, efficient , and thus profitable otherwise its just a hobby.
Its still a real buzz to take a piece of metal, and interpret it into the end product, then someone sees it and wants it badly enough to spend part of next months salary on it.
Finally, im also humbled by seeing something I made say 30, 40 yrs ago, my not recognising the person, and they comment it still their favorite piece.
As for making things that are repairable? or indestructible?
It has to be that way for me.
Ted.

Hi Niel, thanks for this link. I get lots of repairs offered to me, particularly boxes and their hinges. Im so cross with the original makers who for example use a ordinary iron/ hinge pin on a vinaigrette that rusts in due to the water in the perfume, then the hinge breaks off the lid .
It virtually impossible on something as small and delicate to remove the pin. with out risking the fragility of the piece. Ive had to turn away several this past year.
Even with the finest piercing saw blade its impossible to cut the hinge length wise to open it up to remove the rusted pin. The pin should always be from nickel brass.

Ted.

Keeping in line with our great Edward Frater, I just remembered a cute &
honest phrase. In making a new object that is almost impossible to create*
“impossible things get made everyday, miracles take a bit longer!*”

*Gerry Lewy *
Toronto.

1 Like

HI,
I do 2 things to help. One is to either drill a hole or 2 in bezel bottom before setting the stone. You can push a pointy thing in to push the stone out. You could make it an interesting design too, maybe a design that becomes one of you signatures?
The other is to use Attack if you glued the stone in. But I don’t know what Attack would do to Labradorite.

Esta Jo
Back from Australia. Thanks for all the advice about where to go. There was no free time. I need to go back!

1 Like

Ted,

“As for making things that are repairable? or indestructible?
It has to be that way for me.”
Goldsmiths do their best to achieve something repairable or indestructible,
however, I think you understand that jewelry, rings, earrings, and pendants are much more fragile than an item produced by one of your
presses or minting machines.
Belt buckles are where the cross over is, design and method of manufacture might be different, but the goal is the same, make something that will last decades without any failure and reduce the ability of the person wearing it to cause damage or abuse, a belt buckle has much less chance of being subjected to the abuse of something fairly delicate that is worn on a finger.
Perhaps you are not aware of the abuse
that a customer can subject finger rings to.
A woman wearing a ring on fingers on both hands, clapping can subject a ring to being hammered, producing a hammer texture on gold or sterling rings, usually on the bottom of the shank.
And then there are women who clap wearing a diamond ring which is smashed against a ring on the opposite hand, resulting in damage to the metal, and sometimes causing a diamond to cleave, or chip the girdle. I have seen significant portions of a diamond chipped off the edges.
I wonder how you would design or manufacture a finger ring that would withstand the abuse we see? And just from wear, prongs or bezels are subjected to wear, and then there is the issue of when two rings are worn on the same finger, both rings suffer damage from the two rubbing together, some people have them soldered
together, some people would rather have the option to wear one or both and will not consider the solution to prevent friction from
causing wear that leads to structural failure.

Hi Richard,

Its 4am here and I do awake around now , make up the fires, and heat up some cocoa. And of course looked to see if you have had a moment to think about my thoughts. Thanks for that!
And, your reply is interesting, because ignorance is bliss? not doing rings with diamonds relieves me of the damage issues
you describe. I was not aware of that kind of damage.
So what would I do? to look for a solution? ill give it some thought and come back in a couple of days IF I have thought anything constructive.
Ive only had one instance of user abuse , and that was a fired blue titanium ring, that came back asking why the colour had worn off. I asked what had she been doing? to damage it so much? she had been building an alpine rock garden.

Your comments regarding buckles, there one of my pet products, 1stly as they were a mount for the enamelling I started out doing, then the design of the back plate came about. This was designed to be made entirely cold, with no soldering any components. And it had to be strong enough to take any wearers weight. This includes the leather and its attachment to the buckle. Again a press worked component. The leather was usually veg tanned cow best back, some 3/16th in thick. I supplied this as well.
This was for the oval plaques I now could make economically with the use of the drop hammer and one needs press tools and a fly press for the piercing of the 3 tabs needed in the buckle back… Also a 6 ton crank press to blank out the 3 by 2in oval in 1/10th in thick gilding metal. The rest of the forming is with hand tools. The minted ront is finally riveted to this back.
The fronts are either, sterling, or nickel silver, or bronze or copper.
Of course one can make/ saw these components by hand, but the time involved rules it out on economic grounds.
This press can cycle at 88 strokes a min if its setup for auto feed, but I just use it on individual stroke foot operated control , with 2 hands moving the metal sheet. fingers out of the way!.
And, currently, my 50th anniversary buckle using the “Night” and “Day” designs by Bertel Thorwaldsen, There was a picture posted somewhere here recently.
Another example where having the tooling leads to interesting and profitable work.
I made the 1880’ drop stamp, fully portable, the idea being that one could then make a product AT an exhibition FOR the exhibition. A lot of work, to build this machine framing, correct and in period with nuts etc square, no hex! all with varnished wood and shiny bright metalwork. Apart from reworking the lift mechanism. Ive 3 hammers for it 50. 100 and 275lbs. If youve seen the 25 silver mdalolions I posted lastb week , these were make with the 275 lb hammer. Its surprising what tonnage one needs.
The 1st time ever! I took this on the road, was in July 1989 when I was comissioned to mint a medal for the 25th anniversary of Art in Action. A by invitation juried applied art show.
In Sept I was asked to bring it to the ~Dorset
steam fair, some 35,000 people over 5 days. That was an eye opener. I took with me 200 blanks, and used them up in the 1st day. I had to come back here and blank out every bit of brass copper bronze sheet I had . .
Over the 5 days, minted 1000 all sold off the hammer.
I was seen there by some German visitors who asked me to come to their 100th rebuilding of their castle anniversary and mint 500 silver 10 gram coins as a turnkey project including
the die design, production all the packaging printing etc… And so it grew. 2 visits for minting at the National railway museum, in Utrecht Holland etc the following year.
On average 4 times a year in Europe.
For that one needs of course a suitable commercial vehicle, The total weight of the exhibition unit plus machinery comes to 2.5 tons. With a trailer home up behind. we call them caravans!.
This type of work is by negotiation and contract. with part payment in advance.
Just a different way of working.
Ted.

Bezel wasn’t rolled. It was just really stuck! Thanks